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- Path: sparky!uunet!munnari.oz.au!spool.mu.edu!hri.com!noc.near.net!black.clarku.edu!vax.clarku.edu!hsims
- From: hsims@vax.clarku.edu
- Newsgroups: talk.abortion
- Subject: Re: Spoken Like a True ProLifer
- Message-ID: <30DEC92.15253702@vax.clarku.edu>
- Date: 30 Dec 92 15:25:37 GMT
- Sender: news@black.clarku.edu (USENET News System)
- Organization: Clark University
- Lines: 88
-
-
- In a previous article, vengeanc@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu wrote:
- >hsims@vax.clarku.edu writes:
- >>In a previous article, vengeanc@uxa.cso.uiuc.edu wrote:
- >>>jdahl@rchland.vnet.ibm.com (Jared Dahl) writes:
-
- >>>An unborn baby has undertaken no conscious action of any kind, nor with
- >>>any malice, to threaten any member of society. Thus, without due process,
- >>>it is your contention that this baby be found guilty of nothing and
- >>>sentenced to death for it.
-
- >>Fetuses do pose a threat to members of society - the women that they are
- >>living inside of. Every pregnant woman faces a risk of death that is greater
- >>than 0.00.
-
- >So do people driving cars. The issue is whether someone has demonstrated
- >through an ACTION they have willingly undertaken that they are a LARGE
- >threat. This is a very weak argument you present here.
-
- If you feel that the risk involved with driving is too great, you have a right
- to stop driving. If a woman feels that her pregnancy is posing to great a
- risk to her life, she has a right to have an abortion and stop being pregnant.
-
- >>>The resistance you hear from "us" concerning social programs is not
- >>>a result of our lack of respect or concern for human life, rather it is
- >>>from the opposite, our concern for human life. Creating a welfare state
- >>>inhibits people's belief in themselves, promotes and reinforces their
- >>>feelings of helplessness rather than encouraging the desire to change their
- >>>situation by themselves, and punishes those who have accepted the
- >>>responsibility for their own destiny (ie. people who work).
-
- >>Really, those poor, homeless, and hungry children should just take
- >>responsibility for their lives and find a job. Funding programs such as
- >>WIC will just encourage infants and children to be lazy bums.
-
- >Those poor, homeless and hungry children should have had parents responsible
- >enough to realize they couldn't afford to feed children. If they could
- >have controlled their hormones there wouldn't be a problem.
-
- It sounds like you are blaming poor, homeless and hungry children for being
- born to parents who's sex lives you don't approve of. They should have had
- responsible parents? I don't think they had much say in the matter. This
- is really bizzare.
-
- >You tell me which
- >is the worse crime, society refusing to pay deadbeats or deadbeats knowingly
- >bringing children into the world whom they cannot feed. Would any decent
- >person bring children into this world to watch them starve? I think not.
-
- Whether or not these people are "decent", the fact remains that there are
- millions of poor, homeless, and hungry children in the world. They exist.
- What do you suggest we do about them?
-
- >And yes, wasteful social programs WILL encourage children to be bums because
- >they learn by the example of their parents.
-
- >Only an idiot would hold children responsible for the stupidity and
- >cruelty of their parents. If programs that help these children could be
- >enacted that would truly be uncorruptable and beneficial to them, they would
- >be warranted.
-
- Such as?
-
- >>>This is not meant to imply that certain situations don't exist where some
- >>>assistance is warranted, but rather that many more exist that would be
- >>>better solved by encouraging self-dependence rather than state-dependence.
- >
- >>But when it comes to abortion, you would rather have the state take charge
- >>than let the pregnant woman make her own decision about her life and her body?
- >
- >Abortion is murder. It's not a question of just the mother's life, but also
- >the baby's. The laws of this country already state that murder is wrong so
- >in fact the state already has control over this issue. The only problem is
- >in making people aware of what abortion really is... cold blooded, vicious,
- >violent, painful MURDER.
-
- You may think abortion is murder, but the laws of the U.S. do not. Abortion
- happens to be perfectly legal. But just out of curiousity, what kind of
- punishment do you think women who have abortions should recieve?
-
- >This isn't the forum to discuss abortion. If you would like to argue it go
- >to talk.abortion.
-
- I'm reading it on talk.abortion. Where are you?
-
- >Edward Simmonds
-
- .... Heather.
-