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- Newsgroups: alt.msdos.programmer,comp.os.msdos.programmer,comp.sys.ibm.pc.programmer,comp.lang.c++,comp.lang.c
- Path: sparky!uunet!grebyn!daily!malak
- From: malak@grebyn.com (Michael Malak)
- Subject: Re: Newbie Wants Advice on C-Programming
- Message-ID: <1992Dec25.073517.16089@grebyn.com>
- Organization: Grebyn Timesharing
- References: <1992Dec24.154204.25248@blkbox> <1992Dec24.230420.4243@sequent.com> <1992Dec25.050515.20871@ncsu.edu>
- Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1992 07:35:17 GMT
- Lines: 66
-
- In article <1992Dec25.050515.20871@ncsu.edu> bank@lea.csc.ncsu.edu (Belgarath the Sorcerer) writes:
- > I'd like to follow-up on some subsequent Posts on this thread.
- >
- >2) The "Learn C or C++?" question can ONLY be answered by first
- > asking "OOP or traditional?" If you are and/or want to stay
- >
- > a traditional, top-down programmer, go with C. If you want
- > to get into OOP, go with C++.
-
- Asking "OOP or traditional" is like asking "Open end wrench or socket
- set". You use each tool where appropriate, and as I said in my previous
- post, you need years of traditional C experience before you can realize
- where C++'s OOP can benefit you without miring you too much in
- inefficency. If you read anyone's report of practical experience with
- C++, they tell you the hard thing to learn is where _not_ to use OOP.
-
- >
- >3) If you are going to go into OOP, DO NOT start off with
- > stuff like Pascal, as one person has suggested. OOP is a
- > completely different mindset than the traditional forms used
- > by Pascal and C. The best language for learning OOP is,
- > of course, Smalltalk. I wouldn't want to DEVELOP anything
- > in Smalltalk, but if I were to start learning OOP, I think
- > that would be the best language to learn the concepts in.
-
- The goal is to develop, not to use the wrench.
-
- >
- >4) Even if you're not going into OOP, do NOT take up Pascal as
- > a road to C. Pascal is a language that assumes you know
- > very little and places lots of restrictions and
- > inhibitions on you. If you already are a traditional-style
- > programmer, you don't need the knowledge Pascal will
- > teach you (modularization, declaration, etc). Go on into
- > C and avoid having to unlearn all the limits Pascal will
- > place on you.
-
- Oh? Have you ever seen C code written by a former FORTRAN programmer?
- If so, by how many? Universally you will find:
- 1) Very short, illegible variable and function names, with the
- first character wasted (all integers must start with 'i', don't
- you know)
- 2) No use of structures
- 3) No linked lists or trees
- 4) No whitespace
- 5) Lots of illegible "creative" formulas
- 6) No comments
-
- As I said in my previous post, the goal a C programmer should have is to
- make his program look like Pascal while knowing full well it's just
- shorthand for assembly.
-
- >
- >5) Picking up Assembler prior to learning C isn't a bad idea.
- > Hardly required, tho.
-
- It's blase attitudes such as that that are responsible for so many
- bug-ridden programs. Besides allowing one to understand what is
- really going on, assembly is necessary for tracking down compiler
- bugs. In my opinion, you cannot be a real C programmer without knowing
- assembly.
-
- There is just _so_ much involved with learning C fully. Shortcuts lead
- to mediocre proficiency, which leads to disaster in a language as
- unforgiving and flexible as C.
-
-