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- Newsgroups: alt.games.sf2
- Path: sparky!uunet!munnari.oz.au!newsroom.utas.edu.au!bruny.cc.utas.edu.au!tmorris
- From: tmorris@bruny.cc.utas.edu.au (Tim Morris)
- Subject: Re: The cheapness of Bison
- Message-ID: <tmorris.725285305@bruny>
- Sender: news@newsroom.utas.edu.au
- Organization: University of Tasmania, Australia.
- References: <tmorris.724734344@bruny> <1992Dec22.121930.1786@mercury.unt.edu> <tmorris.725103360@bruny> <1992Dec23.234711.29084@mercury.unt.edu>
- Date: Fri, 25 Dec 1992 12:08:25 GMT
- Lines: 83
-
- jbw@ponder.csci.unt.edu (WEST JASON BRUCE) writes:
-
- >Newbie vs. Newbie:
- > We have 2 newbies - neither understand position or any of the finer points
- >of the game. Bison has his torpedo down - and knows no other special moves
- >exist. Ken has his fireball down - and knows no other special moves exist.
- >Who will win in this hypothetical situation?
- > If the Ken is taught in 5 minutes how to tick (short, throw - short short
- >,throw) I think he will win after about 10 losses.
-
- If the Ken player is taught how to tick, then it's fair to assume that
- the Bison player is able to jab-jab-throw tick as well. So, knock Ken
- down with a single torpedo and the round's over! What I'm trying to
- say is that your argument of a ticking Ken putting Bison in the grave
- is fairly pointless, since Bison has at least as much ticking potential
- as Ken.
-
- >Ken can simply fireball and roundhouse kick any Bison who jumps fireballs.
- >He will quickly learn to jump torpedoes.
-
- I have several problems with this.
-
- 1. It's easier to jump a fireball than a torpedo.
- 2. If Bison jumps over a fireball, he can newbie combo Ken (eg. aerial
- roundhouse, forward sweep, endless torpedo routine). This comes down
- to a guessing game - Bison has to jump slightly after Ken throws a
- fireball. I think the law of averages says that Bison will win
- this scenario in the long run, especially since newbie Kens aren't
- particularly creative when it comes to faking their fireballs.
- 3. If Ken jumps over a torpedo, he gains nothing.
- 4. Bison can afford to block about 15 fireballs for every time Ken blocks
- a torpedo. (The blocked torpedo hits for 6 "clicks" on a newbie, each
- click is equivalent to two or three blocked fireballs).
-
- >And once Ken gets in on Bison, Bison will lose the match.
- >A newbie Bison will have no shot at reversing ken's tick.
-
- Bison's jab-jab-throw will win just as easily as Ken's short-short-throw.
-
- >Master v Master:
-
- > No problem. This is the real problem with Bison - he sucks as a character.
-
- I think you're being a bit harsh, in fact I tend to agree with CyberGeek's
- assessment that Bison has a slightly better than average chance of beating
- many of the characters (I've included his rating below).
-
- Character Chance of defeating: Total % chance
- used Ryu Ken ChL E.H Zan Bla Dha Gui Bal Vega Sag Bis Score winning
- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
- M. Bison 6 6 6 6 4 7 6 4 8 5 6 5 69 57.5
-
-
- >Bison plateus VERY early. After his basic ticks and defense are learned, he's
- >a done deal. His incredibly long hang time make him a sitting duck for Ken's
- >DP. His torpedo is nullified by a master Ken's fireballs and DPs.
-
- Ken can only fireball when Bison isn't charged for the headstomp. This
- forces Ken to take the fight up to Bison, which effectively plays into
- Bison's hands. Bison's greatest weakness (long hang time) is a plus for
- Ken, but a cagey Bison generally sticks to the ground and plays a waiting
- game (like Guile vs. Blanka on the classic).
-
- >The side question of "who's moves are harder':
-
- >[fireballing is roughly as hard as sonic booming]
-
- Agreed.
-
- I don't see how you can equate DP with head stomp though.
-
- >[back to newbie vs. newbie again...]
- >A better example would be King Guile. A newbie Guile who knows razor kick
- >can sit crouched and beat all Bison's moves, period.
-
- Agreed. But Bison will thrash Chun Li, Sagat, Vega, Blanka, Balrog, Dhalsim
- and Honda, and will have a better than even shot vs. Ken, Ryu and Zangief.
- Bison's advantage vs. these characters remains until a high skill level
- is reached, at which point I agree with the table above.
-
- --
- Tim Morris
-
-