NetNews Usenet Archive 1992 #27

home *** CD-ROM | disk | FTP | other *** search

/ NetNews Usenet Archive 1992 #27 / NN_1992_27.iso / spool / comp / lang / cplus / 16481 < prev next >

Wrap

Text File | 1992-11-17 | 24.9 KB | 699 lines

Newsgroups: comp.lang.c++ Path: sparky!uunet!charon.amdahl.com!pacbell.com!ames!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!sdd.hp.com!saimiri.primate.wisc.edu!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!cis.ohio-state.edu!pacific.mps.ohio-state.edu!linac!att!att!dptg!ucs!skdutta From: skdutta@ucs.att.com (Saumen Dutta) Subject: C++ Product List - Version 2.04 - Part 3/8 Message-ID: <1992Nov18.022550.279@ucs.att.com> Organization: AT&T Universal Card Services, Jacksonville FL Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 02:25:50 GMT Lines: 689 2.8. Comeau C++ 3.0 With Templates _ _ ______ _ _ _ ____ _________ + Platforms: *All* UNIX 386/486 SVR3/SVR4, MS-DOS, Amiga- DOS, SPARC, RS/6000 (2.1 versions available for XENIX 386, AT&T UNIX PC, AT&T 3B2, Sun-3, Data General AOS/VS). + Commercial software Comeau Computing 91-34 120th street Richmond Hill, NY 11418 Tel: (718) 945-0009 Email: attmail!csanta!c++ BIX: comeau + $250 and up depending upon platform + Information provided by Greg Comeau (comeau@csanta.attmail.com) 2.9. SPARCompiler C++ and SPARCworks _ _ ____________ _ ___ __________ + SPARCsystem or compatable also Solaris operating system + Commercial product Sun MicroSystems Inc. 2550 Garcia Avenue Mountain View, CA 94043 Tel: (415) 960-1300 + Following are the Prices: 1. SPARCompiler C++ 3.0 - $995/user (includes media, on-line docs and hardcopy docs) - $895/user (includes media and on-line docs) 2. SPARCworks Professional C++ 3.0 - $1,995/user (includes media, on-line docs and hardcopy docs) - $1,795/user (includes media and on-line docs) + Description: 1. SPARCompiler C++ Cfront-based C++ compiler. Full-featured, high- performance C++ compiler with templates. Compliant with the C++ defacto standard, Cfront 3.0. Includes C++ class libraries, extensive online documentation, and support for interlanguage cal- ling. Optimized to take advantage of the SPARCsys- tem architecture. 2. SPARCworks Professional C++ Includes SPARCompiler C++, plus a rich graphical development environment including a full C++ debugger, class browser, class grapher, function call grapher for viewing program structure, a per- formance analyzer for improving application per- formance, a file merge facility, and a tool for easing makefile intepretation and execution. + Source: Kim Polese, SPARCompiler C++ Product Manager, SunPro. email address: polese@sun.com 2.10. ObjectCenter, a C++ programming environment _ __ ____________ _ _ ___________ ___________ + Currently runs on - Sparc machines running SunOS 4.1 - DECstations running Ultrix 4.2 + Commercial software from: CenterLine Software Inc. [formerly Saber Software] 10 Fawcett Street Cambridge, MA 02138 USA Phone: +1 617 498-3000 FAX: +1 617 868-6655 email: centerline@centerline.com + Currently at the cfront 2.1 level. + Current version is 1.1. I am not sure what the price and discounts are; I'm pretty sure there are educa- tional discounts. + Information provided by kendall@centerline.com 2.10.1. NetComments _ __ _ ___________ ------------------- I've only got experience with Object Center ... In general it's a very good debugging tool, it will flag any references to uninitialized variables and any array bounds violations as soon as they are accessed, pretty nifty. The only drawback is the long delay while your source is loaded in and "linked". This can be a real pain if you're using a lot of libraries (such as NIH), because you'll have to perform some rather unatural acts to balance source availability versus load/ link time. ------------------- ObjectCenter is an excellent tool. We use it all the time. You won't go wrong spending your money on it. I know less about the other tools. But most reviews I've seen recommend OC over the others.. ------------------- We bought ObjectCenter, for the same reason you did; we played around with it, and it worked. The problem is, under real life situations, it is ssssllloowwww. Using a Sparc2 with 32MB and loading object-only, our project would take, literally, hours to load. And it just wasn't that big, a few tens of thousands of source lines. This was release or so ago, so maybe the thing is faster now. ------------------- I am using OjectCenter and like it a lot. I haven't used Objectworks but based on the literature it looks like it has comparable features. The one thing ObjectCenter has that I have not seen in other products is the command line C/C++ interpreter. This is really nice. The run-time error checking is valuable also. It would be nice if it had an OpenLook or Motif interface and worked better with emacs. I understand these improvements will be made (you guessed it) in the next release. ------------------- ObjectCenter is a dog; my test application is about 65,000 lines of C++ and C code. On a Sun Sparcstation with 28 Meg of RAM and 80 Meg of VM page space, I was unable to load all the source code for my application. It would run out of VM after 5 - 8 hours no matter what I did. Their technical people tell me that I need 120-150 Meg of VM, and that some of their customers use up to 500 Meg!! ------------------- Here we use ObjectCenter. Its main advantage over other products is that it is an interpreter, so it can detect certain run-time errors having to do with memory corruption that cause segvs and can take days of debugging and hair-pulling to find otherwise. It is also nice that it is an environment so you can fool around with objects of a single class, without compiling and linking a whole system. Its main disadvantages are that it is an interpreter and hence SLOW. I usually get around this by only loading in a few source code files, and the rest of my process in compiled form. The compiled code executes about as fast as under dbx, and I can debug the code I am interested in. Also, you need a hekuva lot of RAM. Our workstations have 40MB, but we have about 100K lines of source code. But even for small processes, you need a lot. The browsing tools are helpful, but not as good as what you get with Objectworks or Lucid. ------------------ There are people around here who won't use ObjectCenter because they think it is to slow to load. The key is knowing that you can only load a few files in source and the rest in object (with the -G flag preferably). Then you can get reasonable load times. Otherwise, it's a nightmare. Not to mention that after a while, it often just "stops working". Nothing more can be done. You have to start again and reload everything. So if you are not smart about what you load, you are looking at two-hour load times. 2.11. EDG C++ Front End (compiler front end) _ __ ___ _ _____ ___ ________ _____ ___ + Commercial software from: Edison Design Group 4 Norman Road Upper Montclair, NJ 07043 (201) 744-2620 jsa@edg.com or uunet!edg1!jsa + Matches the ARM, not including templates and exceptions (i.e., essentially the same language as cfront 2.1) + Pricing depends on the type of sublicensing rights required. Typical pricing is a one-time fee in the tens of thousands to $100,000+ range (and no per-copy royalties), but we also consider royalty-based licenses with low up-front costs. + The EDG C++ Front End is aimed at compiler developers who wish to add C++ support to an existing compiler suite (or one being developed), and at software tool developers. The Front End translates C++ into a high- level tree-structured intermediate form. It does full error checking and has excellent error recovery. It supports the C++ language as defined by the Annotated C++ Reference Manual; ANSI C and K&R C are also sup- ported. Host and target computer characteristics are configurable, allowing use in a variety of environments and as a cross-compiler. Licensing is in source form, with complete internal documentation. It's a portable product. Most of our sales have been to companies using UNIX or derivatives, but we have ported our C front end to MS-DOS, and could do the same for C++. However, there are no MS-DOS-specific features such as "near" and "far" pointers. Bear in mind that we are in the business of selling to systems and software companies that combine our front ends with code generators of their own and sell the resulting product under their name. We don't sell full compilers, and in general we are not trying to sell to end-users. + Information provided by J. Stephen Adamczyk(uunet.uu.net!edg1!jsa) 2.12. Borland C++ _ __ _______ _ + Available on DOS and Windows + Commercial software from: Borland International 1800 Green Hills Rd Scotts Valley, CA 95067 Customer Service and Technical Support can be reached be calling 408-438-5300. Our general number or opera- tor number is 408-438-8400 For purchase contact 408- 439-9103. + No information on the compatablity with Future ANSI/ISO standard + Borland C++ & Application Frameworks 3.0 now includes the runtime library source code which is normally sold separately for $150. Borland C++ & Application Frame- works 3.0 has a suggested retail price of $749. Student and Educational discounts available. + The following features are included: - Global optimization to create code that is faster or smaller - Full implementation of both ANSI C and C++ 2.1 with templates - Windows and DOS hosted Integrated Development Environments - Greatly increased compiler speed for C++ and re- architected to compile the largest C++ programs - DOS Protected Mode Interface (DPMI) hosted com- piler and IDE - ObjectBrowser to visually display relationships between code objects and to help you navigate through your code. - Resource Workshop that lets you "draw" Windows resources such as menus, icons, dialogs, etc. - EasyWin library that lets you convert DOS applica- tions to Windows just by recompiling - Pre-compiled Headers that dramatically decrease recompilation time. - No Microsoft Windows Software Development Kit required. - Borland C++ comes with a complete set of tools for creating DOS and Windows applications. It includes: . Turbo Debugger with debugging support for optimized code . Turbo Profiler now with Windows support and coverage analysis . Object Oriented Turbo Assembler + Information provided by Howard Kanter, Borland Customer Support (76701.251@compuserve.com) 2.13. Turbo C++ _ __ _____ _ + Available on DOS and Windows + Commercial software from: Borland International 1800 Green Hills Rd Scotts Valley, CA 95067 Customer Service and Technical Support can be reached be calling 408-438-5300. Our general number or opera- tor number is 408-438-8400 For purchase contact 408- 439-9103. + No information on the compatablity with Future ANSI/ISO standard + $149.95 + $10 S/H. Upgrade from Turbo C or Turbo C++ costs 89.95 + $10 S/H + Information provided by Howard Kanter, Borland Customer Support (76701.251@compuserve.com) 2.13.1. NetComments _ __ _ ___________ From: meyer@sun.soe.clarkson.edu (Robert Meyer) Newsgroups: comp.lang.c,comp.lang.c++ Message-ID: <MEYER.92May15143544@sun.clarkson.edu> We have used the Borland products, Turbo C and Turbo Pascal for several years in our educational programs. I recently purchased the latest version (ver 3.0) of Turbo C++ and was astonished to discover that it will not run (in any configuration - both tcc and the IDE environment) without 1 MB of extended memory. This is absurd. How can Borland abandon the many users of simple, basic machines who made Turbo C popular in the first place? According to the Borland 800 number for ordering products, they have no C language product which runs in less than 1 MB of extended memory! They will not sell the previous versions which would run in 512K or 640K. So, why am I posting this - (not just to complain) 1. If others (especially at Universities which use Turbo C for student programs on "student" PCs) are as upset as I am, perhaps we can convince Borland to reconsider their marketing strategy and produce a product useful to students. While we are at it, it would be nice if the product didn't consume half the hard disk space. 2. Is there another product which competes with the older versions of Turbo C or Turbo C++? I consider the IDE environment to be very helpful for new students learning C initially. And since this is, in part, a complaint, I will also note that Turbo C++ is being sold WITHOUT the library functions reference manual. I consider that unrealistic. If the manual costs an extra $x to provide, then include it and raise the price. What good is C without documentation of the library functions. 2.14. LIANT LPI-C++ 1.0.8 _ __ _____ ___ _ _ _ _ + Platforms: Sun SPARC, SunSoft Interactive Unix V.4 and V.3 for 386/486, SCO Unix 386/486 + Commercial software available from: Liant Software Corperation 959 Concord Street Framingham, MA 01701 USA Tel: +1 (508) 872-8700 Fax: +1 (508) 626-2221 email: support@lpi.liant.com In United Kingdom: Liant Software Ltd. 2 Caxton Street St. James Park London, SW1H 0EQ Tel: +44-(0)71-799-2434 Fax: +44-(0)71-799-2552 In Germany: Oakland Group GmbH Alt-Moabit 91 B W-1000 Berlin 21 Phone: +49 (0)30-391-5045 Fax: +49 (0)30-393-4398 + ANSI Standard: Full support except for templates and exception handling. + $1,295, 30-day money-back guarantee + Description: - Compiles direct to native 32-bit code - CodeWatch debugger v 5.1.7 included, window-based, supports all C++ expressions - Alternatively compiles ARM C++, cfront C++, stan- dard C, or K&R C - Explicit and/or automatic unrestricted inlining, as part of global optimization - Full documentation including iostream library + Information provided by Prescott K. Turner, Jr. (pkt@lpi.liant.com) 2.15. Objectworks\C++ 2.4a _ __ _____________ _ __ + Platforms: SUN + Commercial software from: ParcPlace Systems, Inc. 999 E. Arques Ave. Sunnyvale, CA 94086 Tel: (408)481-9090 Sales: 1-800-759-7272 email: info@parcplace.com + Based on, and includes cfront 2.1 and host platform cc and ld. + Price - US$1,995 single quantity, USA and Canada. Volume discounts, site licensing and educational discounts available. Technical support priced separately. + C++ source-level debugger, class browsers that show inheritance, caller-callee, file-structure relation- ships, integration with emacs/vi and makefiles. + Information provided by Mike Khaw (khaw@parcplace.com) 2.15.1. NetComments _ __ _ ___________ ------------------- I use Objectworks\C++ occasionally. It has a nice class and function hierarchy browser, and a nice debugger. I used Saber C++ some time ago, so my recollection on it isn't up to date. They do have far better run time checks, and that can be very valuable in producing high quality code. The ObjectCenter folks also have sent me some material on an experimental facility they may or may not support for checking for memory leaks, a critical item again in production software. If this works, it could represent a substantial savings over buying Purify's memory leak product (which is a very high quality product). I'm not overly impressed with the Objectworks environment, but the (few) tools it has work nicely. ------------------- I have used Objectworks extensively over the past 8-9 months. I was introduced to both Objectworks and Saber-C++ (now known as ObjectCenter) simultaneously. At the time, Objectworks was a clear preference. I had an opportunity to take a look at ObjectCenter about 1 month ago. I was still not overly impressed with it (compared to Objectworks). My chief complaint has to do with the debugger interface. ObjectCenter's debugger seems to be little more than a thin wrapper around a dbx-like command line debugger. Whereas, Objectworks has a very intuitive point-and- click style debugger environment. On the other hand, Objectworks does not yet support templates (due in the next major release). Objectworks also does not cooperate fully with whatever window manager you are using. It creates one large window, which covers the whole screen and creates it's own sub-windows by tiling within the primary window. This, of course, is a result of it having been written in Smalltalk. Supposedly, their next release will support separately managed windows under X. On the whole, I found Objectworks more intuitive to use. ------------------- 2.16. Oregon C++, version 2.1 _ __ ______ _ _______ _ _ + Platforms: SPARC, DECstation, VAX/VMS, HP 9000/300, Sun-3, 386/486 running under Unix System V 3.2 or 4.0 + Commercial Software available from: TauMetric Corporation Customer Sales and Support 8765 Fletcher Parkway La Mesa, CA 91942 Tel: 619-697-7674 Fax: 619-697-1140 email: support@taumet.com + Version 2.1 of the Oregon C++ compiler conforms with version 2.1 of the C++ language as specified by the Annotated C++ Reference Manual by Ellis and Stroustrup. + Prices range from $ 1700.00 up, depending on platform. Individual listings with support are given below: 1. Oregon C++, version 2.1 for SPARC w/ ODB, Price: $1800, Support: $450 2. Oregon C++, version 2.1 for DECstation w/ ODB, Price: $ 1800.00, Support: $ 450.00 3. Oregon C++, version 2.1 for VAX/VMS w/ODB, Price: $ 1700.00+, Support: $ 425.00+ 4. Oregon C++, version 2.0 for HP 9000/300 & Sun-3, Price: $1700, Support: $425.00+ 5. Oregon C++, version 2.0 for 386/486 w/ODB, Price: $ 1700.00, Support: $425 + Description of the Compiler: - TauMetric Corporation now develops, maintains, and sells the Oregon C++ compiler and debugger. - The Oregon C++ compiler is a true compiler, it compiles C++ code to object code. It features three switches to allow the user to compile C++, ANSI C, or K&R style C programs. A source level debugger is included with each compiler. The debugger is specifically written for C++, it understand multiple inheritence and classes. + Information provided by: support@taumet.com 2.17. IBM AIX XL C++ Compiler/6000 V1 _ __ ___ ___ __ _ ________ ____ __ + Platforms: Hardware: RISC System/6000, Software: AIX 3.2 + Commercial software : Address Unknown + ANSI Standard: Full implementation of the C++ language, Supports Templates and Exception Handling. + From $875 + Description of the product: - Native optimizing compiler - C++ graphical browser - Class libraries: I/O stream, Complex, Task - Test coverage analyzer - Name demangler - Sample class libraries: InterViews 3.0 and NIH 3.0 - Debugger support: works with AIX 3.2.1 dbx - Tool support: AIX 3.2.1 tools with C++ support - cflow, cxref, gprof, lex, lint, make, nm, prof, and yacc. + Information obtained from John Ferreira (FERREIRA@torolab6.vnet.ibm.com) 2.18. JPI Compiler from Jensen nad Partners Int. _ __ ___ ________ ____ ______ ___ ________ ___ + Platforms: DOS and OS/2 + Commercial software available from: Jensen and Partners International 1101 San Antontio Road, Suite 301 Mountain View CA 94043 Phone: (415) 967-3200 Fax: (415) 967-3288 + No pricing information provided + It will crosscompile output for DOS, Windows or OS/2. Their compiler converts code to a language independent internal form, which is then passed through an optim- izer. (The langauge independt part supports their C, C++, Pascal and Modula-2 compilers. It includes a source code debugger that can convert the information to a form acceptable to CodeView.) Their is an advanced version that includes an assembler, disassembler, pro- filer, resource compiler and a couple of other utili- ties. It's relatively easy to port code from Borland, Microsoft, or Zortech -- most of their DOS specific libraries come in several forms to support the dif- ferent naming conventions of their competitors, and they windowing libraries that emulate those from Boralnd or Zortech. The optimizer is quite good; it generates fast, compact code by making extensive use of registers to pass parameters. They include support for multithreaded pro- gramming and DLLs in all three of their target environ- ments. One particularly nice feature is that the IDE is com- pletely configurable. You can change how the editor operates; you can change everything about what's on the menus and how they're layed out; you can add your own hypertext help information to the IDE. They also use a project system that is very different from UNIX style makes, or from Borland's system. After you get used to it, is much easier to use; it feels like you're pro- gramming the compilation process process. It is also easy to produce LIB files or DLL files (something I could never do comfortably inside Borland's IDE, which insists that the only legitimate target of a project is an EXE file.) One of the features they advertise is a smart linker and smart method linker, that can supposedly avoid linking in code that is unused (including unused vir- tual methods). I've had trouble getting this to work in a completely reliable manner, but the code it generates without the smart linker is still pretty lean. + Information provided by: Kevin Coombes <krc@math.umd.edu> 2.19. DeltaPRO C++ Compiler Release 3.1 _ __ ________ _ ________ _______ _ _ + Platforms: SYSTEM V/88 R40V3 (Unix based) + Commercial software available from: Motorola, Inc. Computer Group 2900 S. Diablo Way Tempe, AZ 85282 1-800-234-4863 + Price: $1,995 for a single workstation. + Motorola's DeltaPRO C++ is based on Unix System Labora- tories, C++ Language System, Release 3.0.1 Product compatible with the energing ANSI C++ standard Product contains templates that are completely integrated into the compiler Exception handling not supported. Source level debugging capabilities available with Motorola's DeltaPRO Toolbox windowing debugger Iostreams library and complex math library provided multi-tasking library provided as of 11/92 Full documentation available + Information provided by: Gilda Jennings (gjenning@urbana.mcd.mot.com)