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- Newsgroups: talk.origins
- Path: sparky!uunet!enterpoop.mit.edu!galois!riesz!tycchow
- From: tycchow@riesz.mit.edu (Timothy Y. Chow)
- Subject: Re: Topic for Discussion?
- Message-ID: <1993Jan28.043135.1745@galois.mit.edu>
- Sender: news@galois.mit.edu
- Nntp-Posting-Host: riesz
- Organization: None. This saves me from writing a disclaimer.
- References: <1k1ri0INN2t7@fido.asd.sgi.com> <1993Jan26.083653.9970@smds.com> <1k5cffINNc6s@fido.asd.sgi.com>
- Date: Thu, 28 Jan 93 04:31:35 GMT
- Lines: 47
-
- After much clarification on Livesey's part, I think I finally understand
- what he is trying to argue. The argument is that, contrary to what
- creationists (according to Livesey) say, there is no way that
- microevolution can have a "built-in" limitation that prevents it from
- accumulating into macroevolution---emphasis here on "built-in limitation"
- because this (or the equivalent) is the crucial term that's confusing
- Harter and me.
-
- Apparently Livesey understands "built-in limitation" to mean something
- encoded in the genotype itself that prevents the genotype from changing
- more than a certain amount. Livesey then argues that the part of the
- genotype which contains this code is itself subject to change, so that
- this can't work. Furthermore, even if we try to "escape" this problem
- by saying that the limit is just viability, exactly which genotypes are
- viable depends on the environment, which is in turn subject to change.
-
- To put it another way, suppose the earth is empty and I have in mind a
- bunch of organisms that I want to design and put on the earth---sponges,
- giraffes, etc. I want to make sure that after I set these organisms
- loose that they won't change into something wildly unlike what I designed
- them to be. I know that microevolutional effects will have some effect
- on my beloved genotypes, but cherish the hope that I can somehow build
- into the genotypes some kind of protection that will prevent macroevolution
- from occurring. Livesey is arguing that there's no general procedure
- that I can adopt to ensure my goal. By "accident" some of my genotypes
- may turn out to be resistant to macroevolutionary change, because they
- happen to lie inside an isolated region of the genotype graph, but there
- isn't any way I can take an arbitrary genotype and fix it up so that it
- won't change much.
-
- Interpreted this way, Livesey's argument has more force than I thought
- it had at first. Nevertheless, I still don't think it's satisfactory.
- It still seems that I might be able to take an arbitrary genotype and
- then "fix" it so that it becomes inviable in *any* environment as soon
- as it changes more than a certain amount. I emphasize "any" to
- circumvent Livesey's comments about changes in the environment.
-
- I should also remark that I can't see any way to argue that there is
- something inherent about the very *process* of microevolution that
- prevents it from accumulating into macroevolution. One must appeal
- to the actual information encoded in particular genotypes, as far as I
- can see.
- --
- Tim Chow tycchow@math.mit.edu
- Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and weighs
- 30 tons, computers in the future may have only 1,000 vacuum tubes and weigh
- only 1 1/2 tons. ---Popular Mechanics, March 1949
-