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- Newsgroups: talk.abortion
- Path: sparky!uunet!destroyer!gatech!darwin.sura.net!ra!usenet
- From: lebow@psl.nrl.navy.mil
- Subject: Re: Estimates of the incidence of illegal abortions
- Message-ID: <C1JDLu.Ctq@ra.nrl.navy.mil>
- Sender: usenet@ra.nrl.navy.mil
- Organization: NRL
- References: <1993Jan15.125423.4796@cbnewsj.cb.att.com> <1993Jan15.233521. <1993Jan23.010405.8289@mnemosyne.cs.du.edu> <C1Frr7.9zA@ra.nrl.navy.mil> <1993Jan27.005534.549@nas.nasa.gov>
- Date: Wed, 27 Jan 1993 23:37:05 GMT
- Lines: 87
-
- In article <1993Jan27.005534.549@nas.nasa.gov> dking@raul.nas.nasa.gov (Dan
- King) writes:
- >
- >In article <C1Frr7.9zA@ra.nrl.navy.mil> lebow@psl.nrl.navy.mil writes:
- >
- >>I'm apparently much older than you. .....I knew some sexually
- >>promiscuous guys and they ALWAYS carried a condom in their wallets and used
- >>them. Believe it or not, the fear of getting a girl pregnant was very real
- to
- >>these guys.
- >
- >If these are some of your arguments for why abortion should be
- >illegal, isn't it also a very good argument for why condoms should
- >be illegal. You say how the availability of abortion makes kids
- >less concerned about getting pregnant, but in this paragraph you
- >also say how promiscuous guys ALWAYS carried condoms. Wouldn't
- >making it tougher for them to get condoms also make them less
- >promiscuous? Could you please explain the difference to me?
-
- I'll try. First, I see you've made some assumptions about the purpose of my
- statement which, though plausible, are not really what I was trying to relate
- to Alison. Limiting promiscuity was not my goal here. I was trying to point
- out that promiscuity has risen greatly since RvW and I feel the availability of
- abortion has contributed to it.
-
- It is certainly possible that, back then, making condoms less available would
- have made some guys think longer before getting a girl pregnant. The penalties
- were much higher then than now. As Alison pointed out, things were hushed up
- then because of the shame associated with teenage pregnancy. I'm not sure I
- understand your point.
-
-
-
- >
- >>Many types of contraceptives kill the recently conceived human. To many
- >>pro-lifers this is no different than an abortion. Please take this into
- >>account before jumping to the conclusion that all pro-lifers are against all
- >>birth control.
- >
- >But the argument you use in this article can also be used by
- >those that oppose all forms of birth control.
-
- Sorry to sound so dense, but I don't follow. Alison had made a comment which
- to me implied that the reason many pro-lifers object to contraception was that
- they really despised promiscuity. I don't deny that at all. I was pointing
- out that even pro-lifers who consider sexual practice to be a private matter,
- still can object to certain abortifacients.
-
- >
- >>I can't speak for Edward but I would say to you (as I would my daughter),
- >>"Please please don't have sex until you are financially and mentally able to
- >>bear a child. ...Know that I will not allow you to have an abortion unless
- your life is
- >>threatened. " Aside from the anti-abortion statement, is what I've said so
- >>unreasonable?
- >
- >I have taught my children that I don't believe they should have
- >a sexual relation until they are ready. I have described to them
- >the pitfalls as I see them to having sexual relations prior to
- >being ready. I have also explained to them, much as you have,
- >what to do just in case they do not head my advise and have sex
- >prior to being ready. They should be responsible in that case and
- >use birth control. Just as I can not always count on them to head
- >my advise regarding when to have sex, I also recognize that they
- >may not head my advise in how to have sexual relationships
- >responsibly. In that case, I am glad that the option of
- >abortion is available to them. So why do you allow your children
- >to take precautions if they don't listen to you in one instant,
- >but don't allow them precautions in another.
- >
- >>- Paul
- >
- >Dan King
- >
-
- Come on Dan. As one dad to another, what I "allow" and what they actually do,
- don't often coincide. I hope you weren't expecting me as a pro-lifer to equate
- abortion with a "precaution". I understand you may feel that way. For me, at
- conception the damage is done - there's no turning back. Should my child become
- a teenage parent I would be angry, hurt, feel I had failed as a parent. I
- would, never the less, continue to love and support my child (and grandchild).
- To me that's one of the liabilities of having children - often their problems
- and mistakes become the parent's responsibility. That's life.
-
-
- - Paul
-
-