NetNews Usenet Archive 1992 #31/NN_1992_31.iso/spool/talk/abortion/53315

Internet Message Format | 1992-12-27 | 4.8 KB

Xref: sparky talk.abortion:53315 alt.society.civil-liberty:7114 alt.rush-limbaugh:12378
Newsgroups: talk.abortion,alt.society.civil-liberty,alt.rush-limbaugh
Path: sparky!uunet!mnemosyne.cs.du.edu!nyx!mcochran
From: [e-mail] (Mark A. Cochran)
Subject: Re: Pro-choicers must condone infanticide
Message-ID: <[e-mail]>
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Date: Tue, 29 Dec 92 16:32:13 GMT
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In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kevin Darcy) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Mark A. Cochran) writes:
>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kevin Darcy) writes:
>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Mark A. Cochran) writes:
>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Kevin Darcy) writes:
>>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Mark A. Cochran) writes:
>>>>>>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Christopher J Burian) writes:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>It is kind of funny how it's "okay" to yank a baby out of the womb piece
>>>>>>>by piece, yet it's "wrong" to let a newborn die a gentle death from
>>>>>>>hypothermia.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The subject begs further reflection and dialogue.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>And it would be nice if you tried to find some facts before the next
>>>>>>time you post.
>>>>>>Anybody who describes hypothermia as a gentle death is doing a fine
>>>>>>job of displaying a severe case of ignorance.
>>>>>
>>>>>Then enlighten us, O Great One. Is the pain and gruesome violence of being
>>>>>hacked to bits comparable to slipping away into permanent hypothermic
>>>>>unconsciousness? We thirst for knowledge.
>>>>>
>>>>Hypothermia is not a gentle way to die. Ask anybody who has seen it
>>>>happen.
>>>
>>>RELATIVELY speaking, though, compared to being "hacked to bits", is it not
>>>a gentle way to die?
>>>
>>That would depend entirely on the circumstances Kebbin.
>>If you're talking about a real, alive, sentient being being "hacked to
>>bits" then perhaps so.
>
>Mark, you made a general statement about hypothermia being a non-gentle way
>to die. My only point is that death-by-hypothermia is NEVER less "gentle"
>than death-by-being-hacked-to-bits, which is the original context in which
>the word "gentle" was used. Do you or do you not agree with this point?
>
>In the case of an unconcious or non-sentient "victim", we can say that
Kebbie, I was responding to a general statement which claimed that
hypothermia is gentle death. It is not. The statement to which I
resonded did not claim it was relatively gentle, it claimed it was
gentle, period. Do try to learn the difference.

>both forms of killing are EQUALLY "gentle", of course. This observation
>is not inconsistent with my point.
>
>>If you are (and I must assume you are, since
>>this is talk.abortion...) talking about hypothermia vs some method of
>>abortion, then I would say the "hacked to bits" is gentler. For the
>>simple reason that the fetus is dead before it is "hacked to bits". It
>>can't feel anything Kebbin. Not true of the person who is freezing to
>>death.
>
>How is the fetus killed prior to the "hacking", Mark?
>
Can you say drugs Kebbin? I knew you could...

>>>>As for the "pain and gruesome violence" bit , can you show me
>>>>any people who have been so killed? I mean, other the Jeff Dalhmers
>>>>victims.
>>>
>>>I decline to quibble over "personhood", Cochran. It is true, however, that
>>>some abortion methods (D&C? D&E?) involve, in layperson's terms,
>>>"hacking to bits", do they not? That is my only point here.
>>>
>>Given that the fetus is neither alive at that point, nor capable of
>>feeling, what is your problem with this method?
>
>Who said I had a problem with it? I just simply disagreed with your
>statement that hypothermia was a non-gentle way to die. It may be non-gentle
>compared to, say, dying in one's sleep, but in the original context in which
>"gentle" was used -- being hacked to bits -- I'd say hypothermia was
>undeniably "gentle"...
>
Then feel free to go sleep in the snow. The original context had
nothign to do with relative gentleness Kebbie. Looks like your brain
is in melt down again.

--
                  Mark Cochran          [e-mail]
These are the views of my employer. They also represent the views of
your employer, your government, the Church of your choice, and the
Ghost of Elvis. So there.