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- Path: sparky!uunet!wupost!howland.reston.ans.net!hsdndev!ncar!neit.cgd.ucar.edu!kauff
- From: kauff@neit.cgd.ucar.edu (Brian Kauffman)
- Newsgroups: talk.abortion
- Subject: Re: Pro-choicers must condone infanticide
- Message-ID: <1992Dec24.222556.537@ncar.ucar.edu>
- Date: 24 Dec 92 22:25:56 GMT
- References: <1992Dec23.013411.7322@ncsu.edu> <1992Dec23.193014.13808@ncar.ucar.edu> <1992Dec24.002114.11825@ncsu.edu>
- Sender: news@ncar.ucar.edu (USENET Maintenance)
- Organization: Boulder CO
- Lines: 69
-
- > = dsholtsi@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) writes:
- >> = kauff@neit.cgd.ucar.edu (Brian Kauffman) writes:
- dh> = dsholtsi@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) writes:
- >bk> = kauff@neit.cgd.ucar.edu (Brian Kauffman) writes:
- >dh> = dsholtsi@csl36h.csl.ncsu.edu (Doug Holtsinger) writes:
- ========================================================================
- >dh> Subject: Re: Pro-choicers must condone infanticide
- >dh>
- >dh> Clearly, pro-choicers who support unrestricted abortion-on-
- >dh> demand must argue that the child should not be considered
- >dh> as a person. This position implies that newborn infants
- >dh> are not persons, since there is no difference between a
- >dh> late-term fetus and an infant, and hence these pro-choicers
- >dh> must condone infanticide.
- ========================================================================
-
- >bk> Do you really believe there are no significant distinguishing
- >bk> factors between a late-term fetus and an infant?! <y,n>
-
- dh> There are factual differences between a late-term fetus
- dh> and a newborn infant, but I have not heard any arguments
- dh> from pro-choicers which would give *moral* weight to these
- dh> facts.
-
- >> All fetus' (of any type) are *inside* a woman VS. all infants are
- >> *outside* a woman. (ie. major physical difference)
-
- >That is a physical, factual difference, but it has not been
- >demonstrated to be a moral difference.
-
- OK, so you admit there's a physical difference.
-
- --------------------
- >> because a (late-term) fetus is literally *inside* a woman,
- >> it is infringing on that woman's bodily autonomy to a degree that
- >> is *obviously* far beyond any infringement an infant is capable of.
- >> (ie. major moral difference)
-
- >Why is the child infringing on the woman's bodily autonomy,
- >and not vice versa? Why aren't they both infringing on
- >each other's bodily autonomy?
-
- OK, so you admit there's a moral difference.
-
- --------------------
- >> because a (late-term) fetus is literally *inside* a woman,
- >> it poses a *real* threat on that woman's life & health to a degree
- >> that is *obviously* far beyond any threat an infant is capable of.
- >> (ie. major physical & moral difference)
-
- >And the presence of the woman can sometimes pose a real
- >threat to the child's life and health. Conditions like
- >Rh incompatibility, or the woman's abuse of drugs and
- >alcohol, can kill the child. Under these circumstances,
- >there's far more threat to the child than to the woman,
- >and the child would then be entitled to "abort" the woman.
-
- OK, so you admit there's a physical and moral difference.
-
- --------------------
- >> Consequently YOUR WHOLE "Pro-choicers must condone infanticide" ARGUMENT
- >> IS RENDERED INVALID because it *requires* your casual "no difference"
- >> assertion to be true when in fact this assertion can easily be called
- >> into serious question with minimal effort.
-
- Can you bring youself to admit that your argument AS STATED in invalid?
- You might as well, it's pretty obvious to everyone else.
-
- -Brian
-