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- Newsgroups: rec.martial-arts
- Path: sparky!uunet!srg!birch.srg.af.mil!schan
- From: schan@birch.srg.af.mil (Stephen Chan x4485)
- Subject: Re: More ki/qi/chi & science
- Organization: SRG, Arinc Research Corp., Annapolis, MD
- Date: Mon, 21 Dec 92 14:58:20 GMT
- Message-ID: <1992Dec21.145820.25353@srg.srg.af.mil>
- References: <1992Dec15.181459.26611@galileo.cc.rochester.edu> <1992Dec16.142126.15756@srg.srg.af.mil> <75698@apple.apple.COM>
- Sender: news@srg.srg.af.mil (Usenet news user)
- Lines: 61
-
- In article <75698@apple.apple.COM> mikel@Apple.COM (Mikel Evins) writes:
- >It is innocuous to say that something is outside the realm of
- >scientific discourse. The issue of whether that characterization
- >invalidates an idea is a philosophical question quite separate
- >from its accessibility to scientific study.
-
- My point is that these clean & pure distinctions that philosophers
- make are not at all reflected in everyday attitudes and subjective experience.
-
- > One need not accept
- >logical positivism and the scientific method as one's philosophy
- >of life in order to be a good scientist (though one can, of
- >course choose to so accept them if one wishes). This is a matter
- >of individual taste in metaphysics.
-
- Very true.
-
- >Logical Positivism is a philosophical stance that is on equal
- >footing with other such stances; its merits are arguable,
- >just as are other philosophical stances'.
-
- Analytically, you are entirely correct. An unfortunate characteristic
- I've noticed in people is that they tend to be unaware of, or unwilling to
- fully acknowledge the flaws in a position. This is especially true if the
- stance is implicit, and is never explicitly explained and compared to other
- stances.
-
- >As far as science and chi go, if we decide that chi is a phenomenon
- >like anger, whose effects are entirely subjective, then we
- >have no business complaining if scientists dismiss it from
- >their realm of discourse. In fact, in defining it in purely
- >subjective terms, we have already so dismissed it.
-
- Henh, henh, henh...I think we've come across a certain kind of
- hypocrisy...
- Scientists often conjecturing the existence of things which they have
- never directly observed, then asking the government for billions and billions
- of dollars to create instrumentation with which to _attempt_ to observe these
- hypothetical particles.
- What's the difference? All these quarks (or whatever) are unobserved,
- purely theoretical and could very well only exist in the minds of the
- scientists (subjective enough, huh?).
- Besides, who ever actually *sees* things like mesons and neutrinos? All
- that is ever seen is their effect on the environment as they break down, or
- as they rip through a big vat of fluid.
- One never actually *sees* qi, but one can observe it's effects. But in
- this instance, that's just not good enough to justify further research.
-
- >(Do I need to say that ad hominem allegations
- >that scientists are close-minded do not constitute scientific
- >criticisms?)
-
- Conservatism is a pretty common phenomenon in closed discourse
- communities - usually the only folks who bother to argue are so zealous that
- they start to froth at the mouth.
- Whether those frothy mouthed guys are right or wrong is another matter.
-
- Stephen
- --
- Stephen Chan
- uunet!srg!schan or uunet!srg!schan@uunet.uu.net
-