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- Path: sparky!uunet!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!moe.ksu.ksu.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!csrd.uiuc.edu!sp94.csrd.uiuc.edu!skinner
- From: skinner@sp94.csrd.uiuc.edu (Gregg Skinner)
- Subject: Re: Criticism: "There's no logic in Christianity"
- Message-ID: <1992Dec23.140717.14360@csrd.uiuc.edu>
- Sender: news@csrd.uiuc.edu
- Reply-To: g-skinner@uiuc.edu
- Organization: UIUC Center for Supercomputing Research and Development
- References: <1992Dec22.213829.25884@csrd.uiuc.edu> <ksand-221292175246@wintermute.apple.com>
- Date: Wed, 23 Dec 92 14:07:17 GMT
- Lines: 71
-
- ksand@apple.com (Kent Sandvik ) writes:
-
- >Hey, this is moving over to alt.atheism!
-
- Mr. Sandvik deleted the section which specifically related to alt.atheism,
- so I will repeat (and elaborate).
-
- Mr. Sandvik has indicated his disagreement with the following section
- of the FAQ, "Constructing a Logical Argument".
-
- ----begin included text----
- It is important to note that the fact that a deductive argument is valid does
- not imply that its conclusion holds. This is because of the slightly
- counter-intuitive nature of implication, which we must now consider more
- carefully.
-
- Obviously a valid argument can consist of true propositions. However, an
- argument may be entirely valid even if it contains only false propositions.
- For example:
-
- All insects have wings (premise)
- Woodlice are insects (premise)
- Therefore woodlice have wings (conclusion)
-
- Here, the conclusion is not true because the argument's premises are false.
- If the argument's premises were true, however, the conclusion would be true.
- The argument is thus entirely valid.
- ----end included text----
-
- I believe our disagreement as to the accuracy of the above section
- lies at the heart of our further disagreement. I feel the above
- section is correct, and can cite sources which agree (e.g. Morash,
- "Bridge to Abstract Mathematics"). Mr. Sandvik suggests that my
- sources counter with his texts, but has been unwilling to provide
- titles so I may verify this for myself. I look upon this refusal with
- great suspicion.
-
- Mr. Sandvik writes,
-
- >As a good counter argument, we don't have mathematicians arguing
- >about the building blocks of logic, but we have theologians
- >arguing about the Christian doctrine building blocks.
-
- We are in this very thread arguing about one of the building blocks of
- logic (implication). However, if Mr. Sandvik is not a mathematician
- his statement is technically correct.
-
-
-
- Gregg Skinner
-
-
-
- P.S. In t.r.m. I gave a simple counter-example to Mr. Sandvik's claim,
- "there's nothing logical about Christianity". No mention was made of
- the trinity in that example. As a result, the following is a red
- herring:
-
- >In the case of Christianity not even all Christians agree what
- >constitutes trinity, and thus to use Christian building blocks
- >to create logical statements is in my humble opinion something
- >that may or may not be true, but that can't be never argued about.
-
- Mr. Sandvik wishes to apply to others a standard for exchange which he
- does not apply to himself:
-
- >Just as a side note, I don't hate Mr. Skinner even if his
- >emails are sometimes, eh, a little bit too personal for my
- >taste.
-
- Pot. Kettle. Black.
-