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- Xref: sparky alt.activism:19793 alt.politics.usa.misc:713 talk.politics.misc:65201
- Path: sparky!uunet!olivea!charnel!psgrain!m2xenix!mtek!bud
- From: bud@mtek.com (Bud Hovell)
- Newsgroups: alt.activism,alt.politics.usa.misc,talk.politics.misc
- Subject: Re: What is United States of America like?
- Message-ID: <1992Dec23.020652.18270@mtek.com>
- Date: 23 Dec 92 02:06:52 GMT
- References: <1992Dec19.232619.6118@nntp.hut.fi> <BzM8u5.JM3@unix.amherst.edu> <1992Dec21.183152.1337@kadsma.kodak.com> <1992Dec22.165059.15776@mtek.com> <1992Dec22.194125.14451@kadsma.kodak.com>
- Reply-To: bud@mtek.com
- Distribution: usa
- Organization: MTEK International, Inc.
- Lines: 51
-
- pajerek@telstar.kodak.com (Don Pajerek) writes:
-
- >In article <1992Dec22.165059.15776@mtek.com> bud@mtek.com (Bud Hovell) writes:
- >>It has been *legal* for *years* for IRS enforcement personnel to seize
- >>the assets of people whom they accuse of nonpayment of taxes owed. This
- >>seizure can take place *before* guilt or innocence is established, and
- >>recovery of assets in the event that the case falls apart has proven
- >>to be problematic. The courts have *not* been striking this down.
- >>
- >>Do you plan to write your congress-critter about *both* abuses of con-
- >>stitutional liberties?
-
- >Are you suggesting that because the IRS has been doing this stuff,
- >I must: a) support the IRS in this behavior, and b) accept the idea
- >that, because the IRS has been doing it, it is now a valid precedent
- >for all law enforcement agencies?
-
- No to a), and yes to b). Precedent being what it is, by definition.
-
- I'm saying that if you grant the power to government to abridge a right
- formerly protected, one cause for the exercise of that power becomes
- eventually indistinguishable from any other. Either deny the power or
- plan to see its use extended. I think Jefferson and others had more
- than a few thoughts on this continuing human problem. But they were
- probably excessively disabled by acquaintance with history.
-
- >As I recall, the Bill of Rights contains a provision regarding
- >'unreasonable searches and seizures'. I would categorize both the
- >IRS and DEA seizures as 'unreasonable'. Unfortunately, the Reagan/Bush
-
- I believe that was my point.
-
- >Supreme Court, led by that friend of individual liberty, William
- >Rehnquist, doesn't agree.
-
- Left again. The power of the IRS to make such seizures was certainly
- *not* promolgated by the Rehnquist Court. That issue was settled at
- a time before either of us was born, and was implicit in the original
- amendment that allowed the passage of the income tax law, which laid
- the precedent. If you can ever find a copy, you may wish to read the
- address by Virginia Senator Byrd to the House of Burgesses, in which
- speech he pointed out the many future transgressions against liberty
- that passage would bring -- and which have come to pass. It's a piece
- of work. (Virginia, by the way, never ratified, thus demonstrating
- that not *all* state legislatures were then dominated by wishful
- fools.)
- --
- ________________________________________________________________
- bud@mtek.com ... uunet!m2xenix!mtek!bud ... bud@rigel.cs.pdx.edu
- MTEK International, Inc. Throughput Technology Corp.
- Walk the talk.
-