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- Newsgroups: talk.origins
- Path: sparky!uunet!timbuk.cray.com!hemlock.cray.com!cherry09!robd
- From: robd@cherry09.cray.com (Robert Derrick)
- Subject: Re: What is consciousness?
- Message-ID: <1992Nov20.162001.7604@hemlock.cray.com>
- Lines: 55
- Nntp-Posting-Host: cherry09
- X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
- References: <1ejftgINN5cq@agate.berkeley.edu>
- Date: 20 Nov 92 16:20:01 CST
-
- Tim Ikeda (timi@mendel.berkeley.edu) wrote:
- :
- : How can a "manufactured" virus be distinguished from a physically
- : identical, "conscious" virus? Based on the stereotyped, "reductionist"
- : view of "orthodox" science, we should not be able to tell the difference
- : between the two viruses. How would the "exanded, non-physical" paradigm
- : which you have suggested, be able to accomplish the differentiation?
-
- KD is not likely to tell you. So I will tell you, and then, if KD
- disagrees, he/she/it/they can leap to the defense.
-
- NOTE for the HI: this post is virtually content free, and may be
- consumed with little or no intellectual edification
-
- In Thompson's Introduction, he says,
-
- The ultimate goal of these procedures is to elevate the
- consciousness of the individual jivatma [soul] so that
- he can reciprocate with the Absolute Person on a direct,
- personal level. Once this is accomplished, the person
- attains incontrovertible knowledge of the nature and
- meaining of his own existence. [p.8]
-
- That is, the first way that life can be told from non-life is for the
- life itself to get cozy with the Cosmic Muffin, until through a personal
- contact, the jivatma becomes aware of itself. In most of life, the
- jivatma is drowsing, so a virus jivatma is not likely to ever wake up
- long enough to put a call through to the Big Cheese.
-
- Method number two would be for the viri to be observed by someone who
- had achieved the ultimate in realization, as described above, and then
- that jivatma would be able to immediately recognize other jivatma, even
- in their most primative state.
-
- The big question, for me, is where does the virus jivatma come from (no
- sperm!), and when a virus is dismantled in a lab, where does the jivatma
- go, since at this point the virus is quite dead (assuming it was alive
- in the first place, which is also subject to some debate, however not
- amongst the devotees of bhakti-yoga, therefore, of no purpose in this
- context). When the pieces of the dead virus are reassembled, the virus
- becomes viable again, so to speak. Does its former jivatma zoom back
- from whereever it has been waiting? Does it get a new jivatma? Does it
- not get one, in which case, the enlightened yogi (a person, in this case,
- not a National Park bear) would be able to tell, just by looking at it.
- Probably doesn't even need a look. Just a mention would suffice.
-
- So, the answer is, an enlightened person obtains methods of observation
- that are beyond ordinary ken, and natural technology, but are just as
- real as the words you are reading now. This extra-ordinary ability
- enables them to directly contact any jivatma in question.
-
- Any questions?
- --
-
- rob derrick robd@cherry.cray.com
-