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- Newsgroups: sci.environment
- Path: sparky!uunet!stanford.edu!CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU!CSD-NewsHost!jmc
- From: jmc@SAIL.Stanford.EDU (John McCarthy)
- Subject: Re: Topsoil as a commodity
- In-Reply-To: gil@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au's message of Sat, 21 Nov 92 03:24:19 GMT
- Message-ID: <JMC.92Nov21112054@SAIL.Stanford.EDU>
- Sender: news@CSD-NewsHost.Stanford.EDU
- Reply-To: jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU
- Organization: Computer Science Department, Stanford University
- References: <JMC.92Nov16000246@SAIL.Stanford.EDU> <-1363575837snx@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au>
- Date: 21 Nov 92 11:20:54
- Lines: 70
-
- In article <-1363575837snx@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au> gil@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au (Gil Hardwick) writes:
- In article <JMC.92Nov16000246@SAIL.Stanford.EDU> jmc@cs.Stanford.EDU writes:
-
- > Some time ago, in the newsgroup sci.environment, I suggested that
- > farmers would be more motivated to take good care of their topsoil
- > if it were a commodity. Thus a farmer with deep topsoil could sell
- > some to a farmer with inadequate topsoil. Land with very deep
- > topsoil, e.g. in river valleys, would become more valuable than it
- > is today. Land with barely adequate topsoil would become somewhat
- > less valuable than it is today. Land with no or inadequate topsoil
- > would become more valuable, because it could be restored. Of course,
- > quality of topsoil is not the only component of the price of agricultural
- > land. Thus where rainfall is suboptimal, water rights may be even
- > more important.
-
- Well, I guess when finally confronted with such stubbornness based on
- patently false assumptions about what soil is and what it contributes
- to the growing of crops (that is, about the the basis on which farm
- land is already valued) as exhibited by our learned resident computer
- programmer, in the end a political counter-revolution will usually
- erupt to prevent such absurd ideas being put into effect.
-
- Perhaps McCarthy, by the tone and content of his various submissions
- to this International forum, might have felt at home employed by Stalin
- to assist in instituting a system of agriculture based on as ridiculous
- a strategy as is exhibited here. If you want to US to end up within 50
- years suffering the chronic mass hunger of its cities the now ex-Soviet
- cities suffer still today, please do proceed with trucking soil all over
- your country instead of investing the time and energy improving cropping
- capacity and growing food by more efficient methods.
-
- In the meantime, if you really do want to encourage farmers to take better
- care of your topsoil, I suggest that you might simply make fewer demands
- on both them and it.
-
- --
- Gil Hardwick gil@Gilsys.DIALix.oz.au
- Independent Consulting Ethnologist 3:690/660.6
- PERTH, Western Australia (+61 9) 399 2401
- * * Sustainable Community Development & Environmental Education * *
-
- I am properly humbled. Gil Hardwick has properly thrown out all this
- irrelevant stuff about land prices, amount of topsoil per acre and
- trucking costs. He has properly ignored J. L. Hurst's observation about
- deep loess in close proximity to land good only for pasture.
-
- He has gotten to the essence of a discussion appropriate to an
- "International forum" - who is a good guy and who is a bad guy.
-
- He calls me a computer programmer. Programmers laugh when they hear
- that. I'm a professor of ... .
-
- Ah, but this is also not the way to proceed in an "International forum".
- Defense is irrelevant! Attack is what counts!
-
- What is an "independent consulting ethnologist"? What does one do? I
- can see Gil Hardwick shouting through his megaphone, "Ah, what I could
- tell you blokes about those abos over there if there weren't children
- on the bus."
-
- Not only a tour guide but a statist tour guide. When I say topsoil
- should be considered a commodity and give computations about the
- profitability of buying and selling it, he thinks I'm talking about a
- Government program. He just wants a different Government program.
-
- --
- John McCarthy, Computer Science Department, Stanford, CA 94305
- *
- He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.
-
-