home *** CD-ROM | disk | FTP | other *** search
- Newsgroups: sci.crypt
- Path: sparky!uunet!destroyer!ncar!uchinews!gargoyle.uchicago.edu!hugh
- From: hugh@gargoyle.uchicago.edu (Hugh Miller)
- Subject: Re: Demons and Ogres
- Message-ID: <hugh.722121298@gargoyle.uchicago.edu>
- Sender: news@uchinews.uchicago.edu (News System)
- Organization: University of Chicago Computing Organizations
- References: <921114182202.126812@DOCKMASTER.NCSC.MIL> <hugh.721982357@gargoyle.uchicago.edu> <1992Nov17.103439.19143@cactus.org>
- Date: Wed, 18 Nov 1992 21:14:58 GMT
- Lines: 84
-
- Terry Ritter writes:
-
- >What corporations (e.g., banks) have typically screamed about is the
- >right to continue to use DES. A few months ago, corporations were
- >screaming about possibly being required to provide remote monitoring
- >access to their private telephone switches. None that I know of is
- >fighting, say, for the right of their employees to use cryptography for
- >personal communications or data storage.
-
- But there _have_ been calls for the continued legality of public-key
- cryptosystems, since businesses recognize the key-management advantages
- such systems provide over single-key ones like DES. Most corporations
- seem happy with the security DES affords, but would like to dispense
- with single-key management problems. It is trivially true that
- corporations have no interest in supporting such crypto for the personal
- communications of their employees, since they don't want to pay
- employees for personal affairs, only for business ones; and it is
- equally trivially true that they would not be concerned with using
- crypto for internal data storage, since other systems already in place
- (physical security, access control, tape lockups, etc.) have been paid
- for and can be expected to do their jobs reasonably well.
-
- > I see no reason to think that corporations would not be granted
- > easy-to-get licenses if they use particular types of equipment.
- >
- > In fact, a March 1987 article in Data Communications magazine
- > described NSA's Commercial Comsec Endorsement Program (CEEP) and
- > Project Overtake encryption equipment in two classes: Types I
- > and II. Type I would be available only to government agencies and
- > contractors, but a Type II "module" would be a replacement for DES
- > equipment, and would be built into a computer or communications
- > device and sold by a vendor.
- >
- > This program was not a success (they "ran it up the flagpole" and
- > nobody saluted), but, clearly, NSA *is* prepared to support the
- > concept of data encryption for business. Not unexpectedly, there
- > was no proposal to provide low-cost consumer encryption, a topic
- > which has been at the heart of the argument here for the past week.
-
- As I pointed out in my original post, the government would likely
- support practically secure crypto for communications between its
- contractors and itself. (There's your `Type I' equipment.) For
- everybody else who wants it, NSA will be happy to ship you a board with
- some proprietary blackbox chips on it for use in your PC, plus a 16-page
- manual containing instructions and a mantra, "Trust us." (There's your
- Type II.) This is not `practically secure' crypto, since it violates
- Kerckhoff's Assumption. Corporations, who pay good money to hire good
- security people who know about such things, did not `salute,' as you put
- it. On the basis of clumsy proposals like this I think it can be
- reasonably concluded that NSA supports "data encryption" if you are
- Martin Marietta communicating with Pentagon boffins about weapons
- systems; otherwise, it supports "data encryption" which we can be
- reasonably sure cannot be read by anybody but your intended recipient
- and the NSA.
- _Of course_ NSA will not support freely available practically secure
- crypto for the masses. In its view, such a thing would only make its
- own task, and that of domestic LE, harder. But the burden of my
- argument (and that of others in this thread) is that we must try to come
- up with arguments, convincing to the public and legislators, why FAPSC
- should be allowed anyway.
-
- > Business use and personal use are two different things. I think
- > it quite likely that the government would like to license the
- > first, and minimize the second.
-
- I disagree (about business use). A great deal of intelligence is (I
- understand) gotten from intercepts of business communications. Why
- should intelligence agencies want to see that stream dry up? (That's
- the whole reason, as I see it, for the `Type II' Overtake equipment.)
-
- > Consequently, arguments based on American business competitiveness may
- > be totally irrelevant to the continued use of strong cryptography by
- > individuals.
-
- I still think that we have to try to construct _rhetorically_
- convincing arguments which, for example, piggyback FAPSC for the general
- public on the need for its use by business. Politics makes strange
- bedfellows, and if keeping FAPSC legal for the use of business allows us
- to keep it legal for use by the masses, let's not kick our allies in
- business out of the sack.
-
- -=- Hugh
- Hugh Miller | Dept. of Philosophy | Loyola University of Chicago
- Voice: 312-508-2727 | FAX: 312-508-2292 | hmiller@lucpul.it.luc.edu
-