NetNews Usenet Archive 1992 #27/NN_1992_27.iso/spool/comp/unix/question/13884

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Date: 22 Nov 92 09:15:00 EST
From: [e-mail]
Subject: INFO-UNIX Digest  V17#006
To: "DGRAY" <[e-mail]>

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Subject:    INFO-UNIX Digest  V17#006
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INFO-UNIX Digest          Sat, 21 Nov 1992              V17#006

Today's Topics:
                      Re: rz problems at 9600 baud
                      Emulation of POSIX functions
                       SCO TCPIP >9 LOGINS AGAIN
                                Re: grep
                      NT ? (was Re: IS UNIX DEAD?)
                           Re: IS UNIX DEAD?
                    Unix v. Dos (Re: IS UNIX DEAD?)
                             Kerberos help
               Looking for Time Series Analysis software
                        Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
                   Re: 2nd time: How to remove files?
                      Re: cron not finding script
                           Re: Unix for a PC
                     Need decompress/merge routine
                   Re: REMAPPING KEYS WITHIN BASH/SH
                        Re: IS UNIX DEAD (long)
                    Re: Searching for E-mail package
                      Re: Telnet as a term program
                 Using a Printer Port Doggle under Unix
                    How to delete a file named -l??
                  Re: How to delete a file named -l??
                              asm. in UNIX
             how to search/replace over an entire directory
                           Re: "find" problem
                How do I increase number of screen rows?
                          Re: C Program error
              BIG IMPORTANT QUESTION PLEEEEZE HELP ME!!!!!
            Re: BIG IMPORTANT QUESTION PLEEEEZE HELP ME!!!!!
                        Re: Unattended execution
                   Question about BSD4.3 swapping...
              How do I pipe to a process already running?
               What full-screen file managers are there?
                                  talk
-----------------------------------------------------------------

From: Michael Faurot <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: rz problems at 9600 baud
Date: 11 Nov 92 19:23:05 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (John D. Boggs) writes:
>
> What are com1fl and com1fr?  I don't seem to have them.  Are they 4.0
> critters?  (I still have 3.2.1)
>

Been a few months since I ran v3, but I believe you'll find a shell
program in your /etc directory with a name that begins with "mk" something
or other.  The RTS/CTS devices weren't made by default when Coherent was
installed, and you'll need to run this script to have them created.  Perhaps
someone still running v3 could be more explicit concerning the true name
of the shell program.

With v4, though the RTS/CTS devices are created by default.
--
+--------------------+-------------------------------------------------------+
|   Michael Faurot   | Domain: [e-mail]                     |
|   ------- ------   | UUCP: ...!{irscscm|mimsy}!bogart!phzzzt!mfaurot       |
+--------------------+--------------------+----------------------------------+

-----------------------------

From: Bob Fisher <[e-mail]>
Subject: Emulation of POSIX functions
Date: 12 Nov 92 17:00:23 GMT
Followup-To: poster
To:       [e-mail]


My boss wants me to port pcnfsd to archaic BSD_4.3 systems (Gould 9050
and NP1) and a SVR_3.2 (AT&T 3b2G) system.  I've come up against these
function calls that are not defined on my BSD systems (haven't looked
at SystemV yet).

    sigaction()
    sigemptyset()
    svc_fdset()
    setsid()
    clnt_create()
    clnt_pcreateerror()

There is much about signals that I don't know and I have never programmed
client/server.  If I to try to reinvent the wheel, it would probably have
a flat tire.  I'd use archie, but I'm not sure what to ask for and how to
limit the search.

Can someone provide C code to emulate these functions or point me to a
system where I can get it via anonymous ftp?

Any assistance will be appreciated.

Bob
 -----
Bob Fisher
Defense Logistics Agency, DSAC-TOL, Box 1605, Columbus OH 43216-5002
EMAIL:    [e-mail]
PHONE:    Commercial 1-614-692-9071    Autovon 850-9071

-----------------------------

From: Doug Pavey <[e-mail]>
Subject: SCO TCPIP >9 LOGINS AGAIN
Date: 13 Nov 92 06:20:00 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

Well, I read Aris' and Barry's messages about what is involved in
getting more than 9 tty's to login.  ttyp00 -ttyp08 work fine, ttyp09
will login, but hang TCP.

How does one debug streams limits problems - determine how many are in
use, or how many one should set up if the user may be using as many as
10 processes per login (Progress Database is wonderful).  All users are
using TCP via 3 8 port Terminal servers. I can get the login messages on
all ports, until the user actually signs in, we don't seem to have
problems.  Seems like streams may be the culprit.  How to fix???

Doug Pavey
System Administrator
[phone] ext 278
Wild Card
We Put The Trade Back Into Trading Cards

PS.  I will soon need to add printers to one of these terminal servers.
I am not sure what is involved in setting up TCP or network printers.

Thanks for any pointers.


-----------------------------

From: "David L. Parker" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: grep
Date: 13 Nov 92 11:38:39 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Michael Salmon) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]>,
>[e-mail] writes:
>|> A quick question I was asked this morning. "Why is grep so called?"
>
>It comes from an ed command:
>
>g/re/p
>
>i.e. globally search for a regular expression and print those lines
>that match.
>

Actually it's Global Regular Expression Parser.
--
Dave Parker
Automated Data Management Services, Pleasant Hill, MO 64080-1331
[phone]/5218 voice/fax          -          dlpinc00!dlparker

-----------------------------

From: Erik van Bronkhorst       Code 3814                               Phone [phone] <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: grep
Date: 13 Nov 92 18:13:57 GMT
Sender: NWC News Admin <[e-mail]>
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (David L. Parker) writes:
>In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Michael Salmon) writes:
>>In article <[e-mail]>,
>>[e-mail] writes:
>>|> A quick question I was asked this morning. "Why is grep so called?"
>>
>>It comes from an ed command:
>>
>>g/re/p
>>
>>i.e. globally search for a regular expression and print those lines
>>that match.
>>
>
>Actually it's Global Regular Expression Parser.

I thought it meant Gorns Rarely Eat People...
--
Erik van Bronkhorst KC6UUT DoD#4342585443 AMA#[classified]
"Truth is false and logic lost, now the fourth dimension is crossed..."

-----------------------------

From: Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Subject: NT ? (was Re: IS UNIX DEAD?)
Date: 13 Nov 92 14:58:41 GMT

hacktic.nl>
Sender: [e-mail]
Nntp-Posting-Host: antares.cc.umanitoba.ca
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Peter Busser) writes:

>[e-mail] (Budi Rahardjo) writes:

>>Where can I get NT, now ?

>Ask MS. I believe it is sold right now. Probably to developers. Not that I
>care.

Can a Joe User buy and use NT now ? What kind of application does it have ?

-- budi
--
Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Unix Support - Computer Services - University of Manitoba

-----------------------------

From: Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD?
Date: 13 Nov 92 15:02:03 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Nntp-Posting-Host: antares.cc.umanitoba.ca
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Peter Busser) writes:

>[e-mail] (Budi Rahardjo) writes:

>>Why do you insist to install it yourself anyway ?

>Because that often saves (a lot of) money.

I doubt it. If you insist to install the OS yourself then you better
start learning how manage it.

--budi
--
Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Unix Support - Computer Services - University of Manitoba

-----------------------------

From: Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD?
Date: 13 Nov 92 15:04:46 GMT

cktic.nl>
Sender: [e-mail]
Nntp-Posting-Host: antares.cc.umanitoba.ca
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Peter Busser) writes:

 ...
>Ever tried to run X binaries without running X? I just did (xterm): Error:
>can't open Display. Anyway, I can run a DOS executable under DR DOS, which is
>a DOS clone. Many UNIXes don't allow this.

Not a good analogy. A better one would be ever tried to run a Windows
program without running MS-Windows (ie from DOS) ?

-- budi
--
Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Unix Support - Computer Services - University of Manitoba

-----------------------------

From: Peter Busser <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD?
Date: 14 Nov 92 13:42:55 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Peter F. Couvares) writes:

>[e-mail] (Peter Busser) writes:

>>>>If you want a nice graphical interface
>>>>like Windows or Os/2, you have to ftp and make that too.
>>>Um, no ... you just install X from the SLS disks, I believe.
>>Yep. But then, how do I know to type in 'startx' on the command line?

>    The same way you know to type "win" to start MSWindows or to
>double-click to start a Mac application -- you read the short intro
>documentation. It's not the least bit difficult.

I don't need to type anything to boot OS/2 in a graphics environment.

Greetings,
Peter Busser

-----------------------------

From: "Paul S. Kilroy" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Unix v. Dos (Re: IS UNIX DEAD?)
Date: 13 Nov 92 15:28:30 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Peter Busser) writes:

|[e-mail] (Scott Kaplan) writes:

|>Peter Busser seems insistant in his response that UNIX has the ability to be
|>all things to all people, if only programmers would make it as such.  Then all
|>the UNIX world has to do is make it commercially feasible.

First, Lets be honest, that is the _real_ subject, isnt it?

Second, Maybe the unix world doesnt want to make everything commercially
feasible. I, for one, love the fact my os and gui are free (see below).

Thirdly, This is mostly opinion, but here it goes. I dont think
unix is ready for the average user. Honestly, they are too ignorant.
Anyone who refuses to learn ls to replace dir is not ready to
try somethign new.. Can any of you remember back to when you first
got your 8086 and threw ibm-dos on it? I can. I can also
remember not knowing how to get a list of all the files.
I said, like most dos users are saying to unix, " This sucks
I cant even get a list of my files", I was trying every command
I knew from other os's, but none worked. Finally I read though every
command in the book until I came upon DIR. My point is, We have
all had to learn new things to move up in the world. Dos on a 8086
is a lot more powerful than a c64, and you had to learn new commands
to take advantage of it. And you did it, and your better because of it.
Unix is a lot more powerful than dos, no one can argue with that,
and you need to learn some new commands to take advantage of this too.

Fourthly, Unix is a lot more configurable..
With all the 100% free software on my computer, I can make Xwindows
go from a ms-windows looking machine, to a system7 looking machine,
to a nextstep looking machine back to the system defaults, only
changing a few text setup files. Plus all this is documented very
well in the man pages for these programs.

anyway heres some info on my 'puter if ya like it..
486/33, runing linux .98p2(see comp.os.linux and ftp tsx-11.mit.edu
/pub/linux/FAQ) I also have a program called xfm, which a freely
distributable file/applications manager, with drag and drop ect.
it is *very* nice for people learning unix, you really dont have
to youch a command line if the .xfmrc is setup right.
ie. my wife doesnt have to touch the command
line cause I setup the file, please dont give me chicken and egg
stuff please..

well, thats it, flame away

disclamer, It is very possible that NOTHING  in this document
is spelled correctly.


paul

--
                       -Paul   ([e-mail])

-----------------------------

From: Steve W Heistand <[e-mail]>
Subject: Kerberos help
Keywords: telnet
Date: 13 Nov 92 15:36:35 GMT
Sender: USENET News System <[e-mail]>
To:       [e-mail]

hi,
my basic problem is this:
I need to get an active kerberos ticket on a remote machine without
actually logging in.  rsh will not work as it requires and active
ticket to work, a telnet session within a shell script I and everyone
i've talked to have no clue on how to do.  I though about changing
my .login file  to have it exit whenever I login and do a rlogin within
a script but our system has dissallowed .rhost and trusted user type stuff.

If there is anyone out there with any ideas I would be most grateful.

thanks
steve

-----------------------------

From: Paul Nordstrom <[e-mail]>
Subject: Looking for Time Series Analysis software
Date: 13 Nov 92 16:12:42 GMT
To:       [e-mail]


Is anyone out there aware of a software package specialized for the
purpose of analyzing time series?  If so, I would very much appreciate
any information you could send me (email is fine).

Thank you very much.


--
Newsgroups:
Subject:

--
--
Paul Nordstrom
Gill & Co., L.P.
[e-mail]

-----------------------------

From: Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
Date: 13 Nov 92 16:52:30 GMT

al.hacktic.n
Sender: [e-mail]
Nntp-Posting-Host: ccu.umanitoba.ca
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Peter Busser) writes:

>[e-mail] (Budi Rahardjo) writes:

>>>SHORT? That's hardly the word, miniscule is even too much... :-)
>>>[list with *9* apps deleted]
>>Have you read any UNIX-related magazine ? You will be amazed by the number
>>of ready to use applications. I've seen a list of hundred applications
>>available under UNIX.

>I've seen those lists.

Have you seen this one :

Commercial UNIX Applications :
Aster*x
Autocad
AutoPLAN
Blast
Corel Draw
Crisp (text editor)
dBase IV
DECwrite
eXclaim (spreadsheet for XWindows)
FrameMaker
Interleaf
Island Draw, Write, Paint
HyperHelp (on-line UNIX help)
iXVIEW/SQL
LabView
Looking Glass
Lotus 1-2-3
Lotus cc:Mail
Mathcad
Mathematica
NetMetrix (network manager)
Norton Util Sys V Unix
Oracle
Q-Calc
SAS
Simcity (games)
SoftComm
SoftPC
SpeedEdit (text editor)
Spyglass Transform
SunPC
SunVision
SPSS
Sybase
Synchronize (calender/schedule)
VSI*FAX
Wingz
WordPerfect
WriteNow
xtree for UNIX)
ZMail
 ...etc.

and zillions of free/commercial xwindows/character based UNIX
applications/utilities ...(like elm, pico, tgif, xarchie, xfig,
xftp, xroach, xspread, xv,...)

>But I have two questions:
>  - for which UNIX?

Different versions, just ask the company. (You like to phone them eh :-)

>  - how much is the difference between a DOS/Windows app and a comparable
>    UNIX app? (Ok, let the flames come in! :)))

I am not sure what you mean by that ?
Most of the commerical applications usually have the same look and feel
over different platforms. I mean Corel Draw under Windows has the same
look and feel with the UNIX version.

 ...
>Because the application programmer made his choice, which, alas, is probably
>not my choice. Have you ever worked with X?

Yes, I am using OpenWindows or X11R5 most of the time.

>If I for instance don't like the
>Motif window manager and I switch to the OPEN LOOK window manager. That makes
>that makes several things look different on the screen. But everything the
>application displays remains exactly the same.

That's what window manager supposed to do. (Like the name says
"window manager"). The application should be the same.
(Actually if I understand it correctly, if the aplication is based on
tcl you supposed to be able to taylor the apps with tcl's "send" command).

>Sure choice has it's advantages, but it sure also has it's disadvantages.

At least you are not stuck.

-- budi
--
Budi Rahardjo <[e-mail]>
Unix Support - Computer Services - University of Manitoba

-----------------------------

From: Philippe Goujard <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
Date: 13 Nov 92 17:41:12 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

u>

[e-mail] (Paul Prescod) writes:

>Two different things.  Asking for a help key is really not as
>"pampered" as you would make it out.  As far as the hard drive:
>OS/2 and DOS both have reasonably good undelete procedures.  OS/2 just
>copies the file to a temporary directory in the background.

Yes this is something unix is not good at. There is no undelete. Maybe
replacing "rm" with "mv /trash" is enough. Maybe not.

>Microsoft has a  *PROGRAMMING LANGUAGE* built into word.  I can't
>imagine why someone would prefer a command line to keystrokes
>and requester windows.

Anyway I don't think it is very fair to compare vi and winword. One is a
text editor created to edit mostly C sources the other is a word processor
with graphic capabilities. Their have very very different purposes and if
you use vi as a word processor there is definitely something wrong somewhere.

>>>Why do I have 12 function keys on my keyboard that seem to do absolutely
>>>nothing?
>>
>>dumb question is this?  Are you blaming your keyboard manufacturer's
>>ills on Unix, or are you incoherently expecting that Unix assign some
>>sort of meaning to every key assignable?

>No it's not a dumb question.  There is no standard for help in the Unix
>world.  The f keys are seldom used in unix programs.  Most terminals
>have f keys.  It would seem this would be a good time to start convincing
>people to use F1 for help, n'est ce pas?


I havent come across many terminals with 12 function keys actually. I'm not
sure you can count the keybord of the IBM AT (the XT had only 10 fkeys)
since it is not really a terminal, it's a computer which can emulate
(sometimes well and sometimes not so well) terminals.

Anyway, whatever the number of function keys that your terminal have I agree
that Unix programs are not using them a lot.
So what can be done to improve it and what are the problems?

First you must remember that the "F1=Help" convention was really introduced
with IBM CUA standard (and therefore Windows and Presentation Manager.
Before that text applications implemented help the way they wanted (and some
still do). Under Unix, X-window itself is just the windows server but I'm
don't know if the GUI (openlook & motif) implement it. (maybe motif, can
someone confirm?).

Another problem to overcome is that many terminal emulators don't work too
well : they treat certain keys locally. When you press F1 on some terminal
emulators it doesnt send F1 to the remote machine and calls the local help
menu.

I suppose that what in the future, text applications will stay as they are
but GUI will provide a common way to call help.
(BTW I also like the help bubble in the Mac interface).

>>>Why does VI default to beeping at you when you try to type as opposed to
>>>editing?
>>
>>Because you're Making a Mistake, and vi appropriately tells you so.

>Why is typing text into a text editor "a mistake."  VI should default
>to typing mode.  It would 100% or more user friendly, as well as compatible
>with the other 1000 programs out there that claim to be editors.

Wasn't vi written at first to test your terminal speaker?
Fortunately when I started learning vi, I had a terminal where I could turn
down the volume, but now after 2 years of expereince I can produce text with
more characters than beeps :-)

>>>Is there a wordwrap mode in VI?  And if so, why doesn't it kick in when I
>>>use VI from RN?
>>
>>a) yes.  b) because your .exrc file is not set up correctly.

>How often does someone want to edit news without word wrap?  Wouldn't that
>make it logical to put word wrap in the standard .exrc file?

How often do one want to edit news with vi? Unless you have been using vi
for too long and you cannot do anything without it, leave it to the
programmers and use a more suitable editor when writing mail or news.

>Because they are not stupid questions.  They are good questions.  Obviously
>VI has flaws.  Obviously unix has flaws.  Everything has flaws.  It is
>frightening the way many Unix users refuse to admit that Unix has flaws.

Use the correct tool for the correct purpose and maybe you wont see as many
"flaws". Yes Unix can be inproved, administration could be simpled, GUI
could be more consistent there could also be an on-line tutorial for new
users etc... The problem is that I may not see the same flaws as you do.

>If you launch an editor from VI, that editor should be a wordprocessor.  If
>it is vi, vi should be in wordprocess mode.  If it doesn't, that is a flaw.

Where did you get the idea that vi had a "wordprocessor mode"? (and wordwrap
is not enough for me to be a wordprocessor mode!). It definitely hasn't. Vi
is an editor for editing C sources. It does it very good (at least that's
the opinion of people like me who have been using it for a long time) but it
is definitely not an all purpose editor. And if you don't like it in the
first place, don't use it.

The only thing you could argue is : why isnt there a choice of editor when
you buy your unix?
The answer is :
    - So far unix makers have considered that if you can't use vi you don't
    deserve to use unix. This is wrong and changing slowly.

    - The real well known competitor is emacs which has the problems of
        - Being nearly as cryptic as vi
        - Being "copylefted" so you can't include it in commercial unixes
        (although Dell includes it I think).

>If help does nothing at the command prompt.  That is a flaw.

Yeees, but what would you expect it to do? Would alias help man -k keep you
happy?

>If the cursor keys are illogical that is a flaw.

I suppose you are mistaking 'logical' and 'intuitive'. For me the intuitive
cursor keys on my terminal are those with the arrows on. And those don't
work intuitively under vi.

On all the implementations of vi I've seen typing :
"a hello <CRSR UP> world" works where "i hello <CSRS UP> world" does not!

Try to explain to a new-user the difference between moving the cursor to a
shorter line with append mode and insert mode !

And the reason why you leave the append or insert mode when reaching the end
of line is beyond me!

>Anything can be improved if we discuss the flaws and discuss ways to improve
>them.  If we treat those that notice flaws as blasphemers, we all end up
>using 1970s text editors in 1992, and unix dies.

Unix does not "die", we are speaking of a very SMALL market of unix here :
the market of personnal computers - low-end workstations. Even if unix is
not doing good in that market (which I agree is important and mostly
dominated by Microsoft and Apple at the moment) it will still be alive and
kicking in all the other markets.

--
 -----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Philippe GOUJARD                              Email : [e-mail]

-----------------------------

From: Daniel Smith <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
Date: 13 Nov 92 20:35:46 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Paul Prescod) writes:
> How often does someone want to edit news without word wrap?  Wouldn't that
> make it logical to put word wrap in the standard .exrc file?


    The "standard" .exrc file is site-dependent.  Your administrator
can do whatever he/she wants with a "stadard" exrc to suit your wishes.
Let me add:

ENVIRONMENT
     The editor recognizes the environment variable EXINIT  as  a
     command  (or  list of commands separated by | characters) to
     run when it starts up.  If this variable is  undefined,  the
     editor checks for startup commands in the file ~/.exrc file,
     which you must own.  However, if there is a .exrc  owned  by
     you  in  the current directory, the editor takes its startup
     commands from this file - overriding both the file  in  your
     home directory and the environment variable.


    Gee, perhaps you could have vi start up in wordprocessing
mode in one directory, and in programming mode in another.  Eureka!

> If you launch an editor from VI, that editor should be a wordprocessor.  If
> it is vi, vi should be in wordprocess mode.  If it doesn't, that is a flaw.

    Why would you launch an editor from vi?  Are you in the
habit of launching Microsoft Word from Brief?  Do you drag a motorcycle
behind your car so that you can suddenly hop on it once you're going 55?

> If help does nothing at the command prompt.  That is a flaw.

    It's site dependent.  Blame the vendors who spend all their
time bickering with each other rather than addressing something this
simple.  If someone types "help" and it does something, chances are
that someone wrote a nifty script in /usr/local/bin.

> If the cursor keys are illogical that is a flaw.

> Anything can be improved if we discuss the flaws and discuss ways to improve
> them.  If we treat those that notice flaws as blasphemers, we all end up
> using 1970s text editors in 1992, and unix dies.

    Yeah Yeah...

    I'll restate something here that I've hinted at in net postings
before.  I don't think Unix will die, but I think NT will get a lot of things
right, and will move into markets that Unix is not in yet, and take away
from markets where Unix is sort of spotty.  And I say this as a 10 year
Unix user who's had it with all the Unix community infighting.  Hey, I hope
NT kicks the Unix vendors into a sudden spirit of mass cooperation.

    There's another side to this whole "oh Unix is so hard to use" tangent.
A lot of people say computers in general are hard to use.  I'll give you
an example (and then some ramblings):

    I saw Jef Raskin, formerly of Apple, talk at the West Coast Computer
Faire around 1977-78.  He was pushing the "Information Appliance" idea, and
remarking that he thought User Groups were a reflection on how computers
were so hard to use.  He was implying that there shouldn't be User Groups;
saying that "you don't see Washing Machine User Groups".

    Well.  I wish I'd gone to mike and rebutted that one, because it's
annoyed me for a long time...

    Computers will get easier and easier to use, Unix along with
everything else.  I don't think anyone's questioning that general trend.
I do think that people tend to expect too much too soon in this direction
though, and I'll tell ya why:

    You do cerebral stuff with computers.  When's the last time
you did your taxes on your washing machine?  Could you design a building
with your lawnmower?  Write a letter with your toaster?

    User Groups aren't just self-defense organizations for frustrated
users trying to figure out how to set something up.  They serve a purpose
that's informational and social as well.  Informational in that you find
out about software/hardware that fills some need you have, social in that
you banter about with people about this or that package (and gee, maybe
make new friends in the process).

    Anyways, I'll get off my "stop expecting them to be toasters
anytime soon" soapbox.  I think Unix gets singled out quite a bit
on this one.  A lot of it comes from its sheer power and flexibilty.
It overwhelms the "learn barely enough to get by" mentality.

    I look forward to playing around with the NT CLI, and perhaps
I'll write one of my own if Microsoft doesn't get it right :-)

                Daniel
--
     Daniel Smith, Autodesk, Sausalito, California, [phone] x 2580
          Disclaimer: written by a highly caffeinated mammal
        [e-mail]            [e-mail]

-----------------------------

From: Peter Busser <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
Date: 14 Nov 92 12:26:13 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Paul Prescod) writes:

>>dumb question is this?  Are you blaming your keyboard manufacturer's
>>ills on Unix, or are you incoherently expecting that Unix assign some
>>sort of meaning to every key assignable?

>No it's not a dumb question.  There is no standard for help in the Unix
>world.  The f keys are seldom used in unix programs.  Most terminals
>have f keys.  It would seem this would be a good time to start convincing
>people to use F1 for help, n'est ce pas?

Right! And since curses supports the F-keys (and many others too) it means
that at least every curses based program could support it. If your keyboard
doesn't have a F1 key, too bad, then you'll have to do your tasks without
helptext.

>With 95% of all keyboards having little bumps on the "home" key it makes
>absolutely NO SENSE to use keys one character right of the home keys
>as cursor keys.  None whatsoever.  Espeicially when h could be a help
>key, instead of wasted on the right arrow, when J should be the right
>arrow.

Uhm, shouldn't that be left arrow? :-) But you're right, it's just that
adm3a's had cursor arrows on their HJKL keys. Why they didn't take the JKL;
keys? I don't know...

>Why is typing text into a text editor "a mistake."  VI should default
>to typing mode.  It would 100% or more user friendly, as well as compatible
>with the other 1000 programs out there that claim to be editors.

Well, I don't think it's a good idea to change vi NOW, as too many people
are familiar with it.

-----------------------------

From: Peter Busser <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
Date: 14 Nov 92 12:58:21 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Budi Rahardjo) writes:

>>have f keys.  It would seem this would be a good time to start convincing
>>people to use F1 for help, n'est ce pas?
>How about terminals without F keys ?

Then you can't press the F1 button, right? So you can't get helptext.

>How about different keyboards send
>different key sequence for F1 ? We still have many terminals without F keys.

There are 10 times more keyboards that do have F-keys.

-----------------------------

From: Martin Peter Howell <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
Date: 14 Nov 92 21:49:19 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Paul Prescod) writes:

>In article <sherman.721291094@foster> [e-mail] (Chris Sherman) writes:
>>
>>>Wow! ODT uses Motif, NeXT uses NeXTStep, A/UX uses finder and SVR4.2 uses
>>>OPEN LOOK, I guess. That makes four different UNIXes with four different
>>>user interfaces. With NT or OS/2 you only need to learn only *1* user
>>>interface.
>>
>>Suppose you don't like it...

>You get another one...like Norton Desktop, NewWave, PM (for OS/2).  Or you
>could write your own...just like in Unix.  In OS/2, the interface is just
>a program that runs on top of the Presentation Manager.  In Windows, I
>don't know how you change it, but there is a way, because hundreds of
>thousands of Windows users use Newwave and NDW.

That would defeat your original purpose.  I think the advantage of OS/2
(and possibly NT) is that it will be popular.  You won't need any skills
to use it and other peoples computers will look the same as your own.
This will give you a warm fuzzy feeling inside.

-Martin.
[e-mail]

-----------------------------

From: Dave Siegel <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD? (long)
Date: 14 Nov 92 22:33:14 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
To:       [e-mail]

From article <[e-mail]>, by [e-mail] (Fergason):
> I disagree.  Not having used too many OS's, I can only recall 2
> that the help command did something.  Vax VMS, and Microsoft Dos 5.
> I take that back, i just thought of Wylbur/MVSX, and VM/CMS.  I believe
> help does something on those systems.

having used many, I can say that most OS's don't.  DOS didn't do this until
version 5.

Also, my version of unix does, but I haven't been able to figure out what it
is supposed to be helping me with. (Dell Unix)  Since I already know how to
use manpages, I haven't bothered to even figure out what it is.

> Why should help do something at the command prompt?  I would much, much
> rather have the hardcopy manual in my hand.  While online help might
> be nice, I really just do not see its absence as an inherent flaw.
> Kelly

Well, I don't know if you have ever seen a grey wall (VMS), or if you've priced
a grey wall, but I *can't* have a hardcopy manual precisely because of the
existance of networks.  Can you imagine how much I'd have to have?  How many
tens of thousands of dollars it would cost to provide even a minimal amount
of manuals to my company?  I can see it now...two greywals, two sets of SunOS
Manuals, couple of DOS mans, System V, BSD, OS/2, Win NT, Win 3.2, Netware,
LanManager, then, a specific set for Dell, a specific set for IRIX, a
specific set for Dynix, a specific set for ISC, one for ESIX, Ultrix, Minix,
Linux, BSD/386, ...have I made my point yet?

Even though I'm a pretty fluent Unix guy, I'd be lost without a bit of
specific documentation online for a clients machine  that is in Cleveland,
or some such, not to mention the all the different machines in one building.

egads.  It makes my wallet hurt just thinking about it.

-dave

--
Dave Siegel              [e-mail]    [e-mail]
SysMgr, Biotec, U of Az  [e-mail] [e-mail]
"The opinions expressed herein are not necessarily those of my employer,
not necessarily mine, and probably not necessary."

-----------------------------

From: Ray Jones <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: 2nd time: How to remove files?
Keywords: remove, unix, corefiles
Date: 13 Nov 92 17:09:01 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (michael) writes:


>    I posted this article in comp.unix.questions with a narrow
>distribution, so I am reposting with a wider range. If you see it
>twice, sorry.

>I keep getting files added to my working directory such as 'xerrors'
>and '.nfs***'. If I put a line in my .login that says 'rm xerrors', a
>'xerrors:no such file' message appears every time I log in. If I leave
>the 'rm xerrors' line out of my .login, the 'xerrors' file starts to
>show up in my root directory.

Looks like the 'xerrors:no such file' message is generated whenever
there is NO "xerrors" file to remove and is silent when it actually
removes the file.  Use:
rm -f xerrors
and rm will remove the file if it exists, and keep quite if it does
not.
--
INTERNET:  [e-mail]   Ray A. Jones; Celestial Software
UUCP:   ...!thebes!camco!ray   6641 East Mercer Way
             uunet!camco!ray   Mercer Island, WA 98040; [phone]

-----------------------------

From: Philip W White <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: cron not finding script
Date: 13 Nov 92 17:22:09 GMT
To:       [e-mail]


In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Thom Anthony McCarty) writes:
::
::I am executing a Bourne shell script, newsrunning, from within cron.
::I have given the absolute filename (including the path) but cron says
::it cannot find the script:
::
::
::helpdesk% crontab -l
::5,10,20,25,35,40,50,55 * 1-31 * 1-6 '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrun'
::30 8    1-31 *  1-5     '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off'
::00 17   1-31 *  1-5     '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning on'
::#40 *    1-31 *  0-6     '/usr/lib/newsbin/batch/sendbatches'
::59 0    1-31 *  0-6     '/usr/lib/newsbin/expire/doexpire'
::10 8    1-31 *  0-6     '/usr/lib/newsbin/maint/newsdaily'
::00 5,13,21      1-31 *  1-5     '/usr/lib/newsbin/maint/newswatch
::| mail page'
::1,31 *   1-31 *  1-5     '/usr/lib/newsbin/utils/create-desc'
::
::(mail msg resulting said in part:)
::Your "cron" job
::
::    '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off'
::
::produced the following output:
::
::sh: /usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off: not found
::
 Looks to me as if it is trying to run:
/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off

That is a file name which includes a space.  The space is just before "off".

Either try removing the '' around the command, or create a new file
which calls newsrunning with the off argument.  Put the name of
the new file in crontab

      Phil White   Tektronix, Beaverton, OR
USENET:  [e-mail]
 US Mail: Mail Stop 59-432, P.O. Box 500, Beaverton OR 97077-0001

-----------------------------

From: Bruce Lilly <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: cron not finding script
Date: 15 Nov 92 01:23:37 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Henry Spencer) wrote:
>In article <[e-mail]> Thom Anthony McCarty <[e-mail]> writes:
>>30 8    1-31 *  1-5     '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off'
>> ...
>>Your "cron" job
>>
>>    '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off'
>>
>>produced the following output:
>>
>>sh: /usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off: not found
>
>Get rid of the quotes.

Is it recommended to run the latest version of newsrunning as root?

If Thom's cron can't run jobs specifically for the news login,
an alternative is to use
30 8    1-31 *  1-5     /bin/su news -c '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off'
in the root crontab file (with the quotes).

--
    Bruce Lilly        blilly![e-mail]
                    ...uunet!sonyusa!sonyd1!blilly!bruce

-----------------------------

From: Henry Spencer <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: cron not finding script
Date: 15 Nov 92 04:56:04 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bruce Lilly) writes:
>Is it recommended to run the latest version of newsrunning as root?

In general, running news stuff as root is a mistake, but in this particular
case it should be harmless.
--
MS-DOS is the OS/360 of the 1980s.      | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology
              -Hal W. Hardenbergh (1985)|  [e-mail]  utzoo!henry

-----------------------------

From: David Barr <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: cron not finding script
Date: 15 Nov 92 05:32:52 GMT
Sender: Usenet <[e-mail]>
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Bruce Lilly) writes:
>Is it recommended to run the latest version of newsrunning as root?
>
>If Thom's cron can't run jobs specifically for the news login,
>an alternative is to use
>30 8    1-31 *  1-5     /bin/su news -c '/usr/lib/newsbin/input/newsrunning off'
>in the root crontab file (with the quotes).

If you read the original post, it was clear that the crontab entries were
news's and not root's.  Fortunately the number of UNIX's with old crons
are getting fewer and fewer.

--Dave
--
System Administrator, Population Research Institute    [e-mail]
  "An analogy is like instant coffee: it can wake you up, but it's
  not the real thing"  -- Peter da Silva

-----------------------------

From: [e-mail]
Subject: Re: Unix for a PC
Date: 13 Nov 92 21:43:07 GMT
Sender: USENET News System <[e-mail]>
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]>, [e-mail] (Deeran Peethamparam) writes:
> Devin Mcquaid ([e-mail]) wrote:
>
> [Description of Linux, a free Unix OS]
>
> :     What is the minimal requirement?
> :     386
> :     4 megs of ram (of course more is beter)
>
> Linux will run with 2 megs of RAM -- with almost continual paging.
> Like the man says, more _is_ better.
>
> DP
>

-----------------------------

From: "frederick.d.true" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Need decompress/merge routine
Keywords: merge compress
Date: 13 Nov 92 22:04:56 GMT
Followup-To: [e-mail]
To:       [e-mail]

Is anyone aware of an existing method to merge/sort compressed files given
a sort key? In other words, I have 10 large compressed files, sorted by
a particular key, and I need to merge them in sorted order into another
compressed file.  The files are too large to have all uncompressed on the
system.

What I need is some sort of utility ala 'sort -m' which will decompress
and buffer input files while merging. Is there such a beast? Is there another
obvious way of doing this that I'm neglecting? I realize that I could polyphase
merge them two at a time, but I'd rather not. The files are very large and
each merge stage would take hours.

I'm just about to write my own merge routine, building in the compress/
decompress routines as an option for each input file, but I thought I'd
see what's out there before I started.

Any suggestions would be appreciated,

Please e-mail to: [e-mail]

--
Fred True
AT&T

-----------------------------

From: Chet Ramey <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: REMAPPING KEYS WITHIN BASH/SH
Date: 13 Nov 92 22:22:40 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: odin.ins.cwru.edu
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Steve Franklin) writes:
>It would be wholly to my benefit to be able to remap keys within the
>bash or sh shell, but I'm not quite sure to go about doing this.

Bash supports this.  The readline library, which is used by bash and
certain other Gnu utilities (e.g., gdb), has its own startup file
(~/.inputrc), and a syntax for rebinding keys within it.  Bash also
provides the `bind' builtin to allow keybindings to be changed on
the fly from a shell prompt.

>Can I map Character sequences to the execution of scripts? I don't see
>why not, but I'm not quite sure how I would go about doing this...

Bash allows you to bind keys to `macros', which cause character strings
to be inserted into the text.  You can bind a key sequence to the
equivalent of, for instance, "ls^M" and have that key execute `ls' when
typed on an empty line.

Chet
--
``The use of history as therapy means the corruption of history as history.''
    -- Arthur Schlesinger

Chet Ramey, Case Western Reserve University    Internet: [e-mail]

-----------------------------

From: Ioi Kim Lam <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD (long)
Date: 13 Nov 92 23:19:26 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Nntp-Posting-Host: pixmap.seas.upenn.edu
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Robert B. McCullough) writes:

> Total B.S.!!    I'd love to have a user friendly application and VI
>is it for me. It grips me to hear DOS users say "VI it's to hard to
>learn". Come on thats why UNIX has got power, DOS doesn't......

If you think that being hard to use means power, go and write a book about
it. I am sure that would be a best seller.

With all my blessing,

    ioi.

-----------------------------

From: Peter Busser <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD (long)
Date: 14 Nov 92 12:52:05 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Robert B. McCullough) writes:

>It grips me to hear DOS users say "VI it's to hard to learn".

I'm not a DOS user, I'm using Linux right now. And I still think vi is hard to
learn.

>Come on thats why UNIX has got power, DOS doesn't.

WHAT? UNIX has got power because it is harder to learn? That's even a weaker
argument than saying that it wasn't meant for 'stupid' users.

>MY opinion like or not--DOS BLOWS!! Girlie OS.

I agree.

>Flame me, cry, whine I don't care.

>Wasn't the Byte article talking about NT anyways?
Really?

-----------------------------

From: Tim Pierce <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: IS UNIX DEAD (long)
Date: 14 Nov 92 21:14:28 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Robert B. McCullough) writes:

> Total B.S.!!
>...
>MY opinion like or not--DOS BLOWS!! Girlie OS.

It's nice to hear a clear, well-defined rebuttal every now and then.
Kind of like taking a good crap.

--
____ Tim Pierce                /
\  / [e-mail] / I use antlers in all of my decorating.
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /

-----------------------------

From: Karl Nicholas <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Searching for E-mail package
Date: 14 Nov 92 00:26:18 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (ANDY KUMEDA) writes:
>
>
>
>We are currently searching for E-mail/Office Automation packages that will
>serve several thousand users based on the following criteria:
>
>  1) Must support X-Window (OpenLook or Motif) either through an X-terminal
>     or a PC running an X-server.
>  2) Must also support PCs running DOS, with a TCP/IP network connection.
>  3) In addition, a non-X version (character-based -- ASCII terminals) is
>     preferable, but not required.
>  4) Must be able to 'customize' -- ie original text to be replied or
>     forwarded should not be modifiable.
>  5) Must support SMTP.
>  6) Vendor must have good technical support.
>

    I don;t know all the answers to the questions here,
but you should call the cc-mail people. no I do not know the
phone number either, sorry, but cc-mail is the name of the
product. What do I know? well ...


--
 +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+
 | Karl Nicholas   [phone]    | Beer is good food.  Food is not beer. |
 | [e-mail]   uunet!odinba!karl | *** BofA is not me, I am not BofA *** |
 +---------------------------------------------------------------------------+

-----------------------------

From: Mark <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Telnet as a term program
Date: 14 Nov 92 01:44:09 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: 150.203.76.2
Organisation: Wassat?!
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Stephen Wayne Miller) writes:

>I'm trying to get telnet to act somewhat like a term program in that I want
>it to be able to send and receive at least text files.  I can even be ok
>with an I/O redirect and no interaction for that telnet session (like
>"% telnet vms.company.com < script_file").  However, depending on the
>machine I telnet to, lots or little of the file's text is ignored as input.

if you have a login on it and rsh is running try:

cats% rsh vms.com -l atario 'cat script_file' > script_file (to get)
cats% rsh vms.com -l atario 'cat > script_file' < script_file (to send)

You might be lucky and get a rsh implementation for vms but dont hold your
breath. It works for binary files as well. Only problem Ive found on some
machines is you cant ^Z and 'bg' it as it suspends for tty input. Plus
you have problems if DNS isnt working properly as it doesnt take IP numbers.

Mark

-----------------------------

From: kirk <@telesys.tnet.com (Kirk Morger):kirk@scarrow>
Subject: Using a Printer Port Doggle under Unix
Date: 14 Nov 92 02:10:49 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

I have posted this message last month, but with no responces. Here it goes
again...

Without getting into a discussion on the ethics of copy protection, is there
any way to genericly use a "Doggle" under Unix? I need it to work on a few
different archatectures, namely 80386 SCO Sys V and RS/6000 AIX. I am quite
familiar with the using control lines on RS-232, but came up empty handed
on information on the Parallel Port (Busy Line, Strobe, Etc.). I am trying
to avoid using an additional driver that would need to be installed at the
users sites because thay would find some way to fry there OS in the process.

I have read through the FAQs, the online documentation, called SCO, can't
get ahold of IBM, read almost all the files in /usr/include/{sys}, and
the SCO Device Drivers Writers Guide (yuch!), and I'm still empty handed.

Although a serial key isn't out of the question, I would hate to have to
require a user to give up a serial port. Neither platform has Ethernet as
a standard feature, so I can't use an Etherknot (even if I knew what it was).
--
+------------------------------+----------------------------------------------+
| Have we been here before?... | scarrow![e-mail] (I Think).     |
| - Or are we yet to come?     +----------------------------------------------+
|                              | DISCLAIMER: My thoghts and views are my own, |
|                Dr. Who, 1975 |             I subscribe to free will.        |
+------------------------------+----------------------------------------------+

-----------------------------

From: "Steven J. Sobol" <[e-mail]>
Subject: How to delete a file named -l??
Date: 14 Nov 92 05:06:57 GMT
To:       [e-mail]


 ... that's about it... the file is named


-l


and I have tried everything and cannot delete it.

I don't even remember how it was created...

any ideas? 10-q.

--
Steve Sobol, Prez. The Tiny Software Co * [e-mail] * [e-mail]
CALL APK in Cleveland, Ohio: Telnet/FTP/BBS/Shell/More!   Info: [e-mail]
All for a Reasonable Monthly Rate. Telnet to wariat.org or pick up the phone...
216/481-9425 v.32bis/PEP; 216/481-9445 v.32bis/HST; 216/481-9436 2400 baud.....

-----------------------------

From: "Zbigniew J. Tyrlik" <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: How to delete a file named -l??
Date: 15 Nov 92 00:55:43 GMT
Followup-To: comp.unix.questions
To:       [e-mail]

As quoted from <[e-mail]> by [e-mail] (Steven J. Sobol):

+---------------
>
> ... that's about it... the file is named
>
>
> -l
>

Point 1, it is in FAQ.

2) rm -- -l
3) rm ./-l
4) ask your sysadm... :-)

>
> and I have tried everything and cannot delete it.
>
> I don't even remember how it was created...
>
> any ideas? 10-q.
>
> --
> Steve Sobol, Prez. The Tiny Software Co * [e-mail] * [e-mail]
> CALL APK in Cleveland, Ohio: Telnet/FTP/BBS/Shell/More!   Info: [e-mail]
> All for a Reasonable Monthly Rate. Telnet to wariat.org or pick up the phone...
> 216/481-9425 v.32bis/PEP; 216/481-9445 v.32bis/HST; 216/481-9436 2400 baud.....


_zjt
--
********************************************************************
Zbigniew J. Tyrlik       DoD# 0759   VF700C '84      [e-mail]
IBM PC SIG Sysop - Cleveland Free-Net    [e-mail]
APK           Public Access UNI* Cleveland,          (216)-481-9436
Feeds, shell, FTP & telnet access        Uniboard distribution point
********************************************************************

-----------------------------

From: Ji-Tzay Yang <[e-mail]>
Subject: asm. in UNIX
Date: 14 Nov 92 14:57:40 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
X-Newsreader: TIN [version 1.1 PL6]
To:       [e-mail]

[ Article crossposted from comp.unix.wizards ]
[ Author was Ji-Tzay Yang ]
[ Posted on Sat, 14 Nov 1992 14:28:47 GMT ]

 Hello,

    The following is a very 'hard' question for me, because I can't find the
    information I need :-/

    if I want to write a piece of asm. codes in C on 386BSD.
    I can write :

       asm ("movl %ebx, %ebx");

    but what should I write if I want to move the address of varible 'foo'
    the '%eax'?

    void f() {
        int x, y;

        /* if we want
           %eax = &x
           %ebx = y
        */
        asm("movl ___, %eax);
        asm("movl ___, %ebx);
    }

    By the way, are there any books or documnets discussing
    the "inline asm" for UNIX?

    Hope there are kind people help me.
--
                                         With regard,

 ============================================================================
 Ji-Tzay Yang (7( 0r 8|)              |  E-mail : [e-mail]
 Dept. of Comp. Science & Info. Eng.  |           [e-mail]
 National Chiao-Tung University       |  Tel    : [phone] ext 6430
 Hsin-Chu, Taiwan ROC                 |  Fax    : [phone]
 ============================================================================


--
                                         With regard,

 ============================================================================
 Ji-Tzay Yang (7( 0r 8|)              |  E-mail : [e-mail]
 Dept. of Comp. Science & Info. Eng.  |           [e-mail]
 National Chiao-Tung University       |  Tel    : [phone] ext 6430
 Hsin-Chu, Taiwan ROC                 |  Fax    : [phone]
 ============================================================================

-----------------------------

From: Scott Howell <scotth@gdfwc3>
Subject: how to search/replace over an entire directory
Date: 14 Nov 92 16:37:59 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
To:       [e-mail]


Is there an easy way to do a search and replace of a string over an
entire directory or a list of files.  It would be nice it was something
like like

$ search_replace -search string1 -replace string2 -directory this_directory

Any help would be appreciated.

-----------------------------

From: Ray Jones <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: "find" problem
Date: 14 Nov 92 17:17:54 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

In <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Chun-Hung Lin) writes:

>Hello,
>
>  I found that the UNIX command "find" cannot find the file
>across the file system, i.e. I cannot find the file on file
>system B when I am now on file system A. Is it true?
>If it is true, how can I do this job? Any utility or command
>is available?
>
Find does not go side way across file systmes but, if you start at a
point above A and B, it will search both A and B.

          |---|
          | C |
          -----
            |
   |----------------|
 |---|            |---|
 | A |            | B |
 -----            -----
If you start your search in A, find cannot go to B, however, if you
start the search in C, find will search both A and B.
--
INTERNET:  [e-mail]   Ray A. Jones; Celestial Software
UUCP:   ...!thebes!camco!ray   6641 East Mercer Way
             uunet!camco!ray   Mercer Island, WA 98040; [phone]

-----------------------------

From: Michael O'Henly <[e-mail]>
Subject: How do I increase number of screen rows?
Keywords: rows stty
Date: 14 Nov 92 19:21:48 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Nntp-Posting-Host: sol.uvic.ca
To:       [e-mail]


    I want to increase the number of rows displayed by things like
emacs and nn from 24 to 35.

    When I dial into my machine, the terminal window is defined as
24x80 and I can't quite figure out how to change it. I suspect it
involves the stty command, but 'stty rows 35' doesn't seem to tell
"full screen" emacs whatever it needs to know in order to address the
extra rows.

    Thanks in advance for your help!

    Michael
--
           Michael O'Henly |     o   | 604-721-7623 (604-721-8215 fax)
    Library Systems Office |  --/--  | [e-mail]
    University of Victoria |  __\    | [e-mail]
    Victoria, B.C., Canada |     \   | [e-mail]

-----------------------------

From: Jason M Ferguson <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: C Program error
Date: 14 Nov 92 20:27:06 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
To:       [e-mail]


    slight modification, I typed that statement slightly wrong:
typedef void (*setvarproc)(char *,int)

    I'm using cc to compile.
    Thanks for your help.

-----------------------------

From: Tim Pierce <[e-mail]>
Subject: BIG IMPORTANT QUESTION PLEEEEZE HELP ME!!!!!
Date: 14 Nov 92 21:19:54 GMT
To:       [e-mail]

My car's making a funny noise somewhere under the hood.  It's one of
these cheapo models, though, and it doesn't have pull-down help from
under the visor available!!!  Can anyone tell me what it's doing
wrong!!!!

--
____ Tim Pierce                /
\  / [e-mail] / I use antlers in all of my decorating.
 \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /

-----------------------------

From: Rouben Rostamian <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: BIG IMPORTANT QUESTION PLEEEEZE HELP ME!!!!!
Date: 14 Nov 92 22:02:51 GMT
Sender: News posting account <[e-mail]>
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Tim Pierce) writes:
>My car's making a funny noise somewhere under the hood.  It's one of
>these cheapo models, though, and it doesn't have pull-down help from
>under the visor available!!!  Can anyone tell me what it's doing
>wrong!!!!

Switch to emacs and go into the overdrive mode.

--

-----------------------------

From: Steve Franklin <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: BIG IMPORTANT QUESTION PLEEEEZE HELP ME!!!!!
Date: 14 Nov 92 22:47:53 GMT
Sender: USENET News <[e-mail]>
Nntp-Posting-Host: ug2.cs.dal.ca
To:       [e-mail]

In article <[e-mail]> [e-mail] (Tim Pierce) writes:

>My car's making a funny noise somewhere under the hood.  It's one of
>these cheapo models, though, and it doesn't have pull-down help from
>under the visor available!!!  Can anyone tell me what it's doing
>wrong!!!!

Wrong group Timbo... This is comp.unix.questions, not
comp.eunuchs.questions. Try again, and this time read your damn warning
when you post (are you REALLY REALLY sure you wanna do this?)
   steve
--
aasdSteveFranklin-Subliminal Psychology Major.ks;dlasBlueJaysRULEkasdfeahsdbfl
sd;lfaswoq[eBuyMeAQuadra!!!mbnZMXCNdfsba;KdSPAMiuroqiyetIBMSuxiweuryth'ewr;mxn
qpuepriuPartyOneqtuj;,n.,xnc,kjasFlameMeNot!;lkj;lkgkjd;askElvisLivesjhfquweru
[e-mail],sk;t;lrut[[e-mail],Physics!eq3rwkh;oHA

-----------------------------

From: Andrew Choi <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: BIG IMPORTANT QUESTION PLEEEEZE HELP ME!!!!!
Date: 15 Nov 92 00:33:12 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: soda.berkeley.edu
To:       [e-mail]

[e-mail] (Tim Pierce) writes:
>My car's making a funny noise somewhere under the hood.  It's one of
>these cheapo models, though, and it doesn't have pull-down help from
>under the visor available!!!  Can anyone tell me what it's doing
>wrong!!!!
>
>--
>____ Tim Pierce                /
>\  / [e-mail] / I use antlers in all of my decorating.
> \/ (BITnet: TWPIERCE@AMHERST) /

If your car is running Unix, try removing /dev/audio and see what
happens.

If it is not running Unix... well, I guess that's the problem.

:-)

-- Andrew

-----------------------------

From: Bob Lee <[e-mail]>
Subject: Re: Unattended execution
Date: 14 Nov 92 21:44:25 GMT
Sender: Bob Lee <[e-mail]>
To:       [e-mail]

Thanks to everyone who replied. I've got the problem solved!

-----------------------------

From: Dinkar Bhat <[e-mail]>
Subject: Question about BSD4.3 swapping...
Date: 14 Nov 92 23:29:13 GMT
Sender: The Daily News <[e-mail]>
To:       [e-mail]

I read in Tanenbaum latest book titled 'Modern Operatins Systems'
that in BSD4.3 when a process page is paged out, the data and stack
segments go out to a scrtach device but the text segment always uses the
executable binary file itself. No scratch copy is used.
I would like to know why? Any answers?

Dinkar.
[e-mail]

-----------------------------

From: "Jethro H. Greene" <[e-mail]>
Subject: How do I pipe to a process already running?
Date: 14 Nov 92 23:41:10 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: poster
Originator: [e-mail]
To:       [e-mail]


Let's say I am running something like talk.  I am talking with someone and I
realize that I would like to print a file to the talk screen.  I can't pipe
to a process that is already running?  Is there a way around this?  (Please
don't tell me that talk or ytalk has a special option because talking is only
an example.)

Thanks in advance

 --------------------------- |\_/| --------------------------------------------
| Jethro H. Greene (Jed) | \`0.0'/ | Massively Parallel Comp. Research Lab., |
| [e-mail]  | =(_-_)= | Sandia National Lab., Albuquerque, NM   |
 ---------------------------   U   --------------------------------------------

-----------------------------

From: Paul Kramer <[e-mail]>
Subject: What full-screen file managers are there?
Keywords: utree, maint
Date: 15 Nov 92 05:14:20 GMT
NNTP-Posting-Host: unlinfo.unl.edu
To:       [e-mail]

Hello,

I found while reading articles in this electronic conference, a
reference to a public-domain program called utree.  It is full-screen
file manager which allows you to perform file functions with single
keystrokes.  For example, after I start the program I see a screen
that lists the files on my account.  If I want to delete one of those
files I move the cursor on top of it, press a certain key.  Boom it
gone!

Well I am wondering:  Is there anything better than utree?  I am aware
of a program called 'maint' but it doesn't have the full functionality
of 'utree'.

Thank you for your help.

Paul
--
Paul H Kramer                    Computing Resource Center
[phone]                     Room 120, 501 Building
[e-mail]                    University of Nebraska-Lincoln

-----------------------------

From: The Beast <[e-mail]>
Subject: talk
Date: 15 Nov 92 08:49:54 GMT
Sender: [e-mail]
Followup-To: comp.unix.questions
Originator: [e-mail]
To:       [e-mail]

I tried to use 'talk' to converse with a friend in another
college. I got the following message:
'Target machine does not recognize us'.
Is the other machine using some new talk daemon? If so,
how can this situation be circumvented? I already used
'otalk' which yielded similar results.

-----------------------------


End of INFO-UNIX Digest
***********************