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- Newsgroups: comp.programming
- Path: sparky!uunet!think.com!ames!saimiri.primate.wisc.edu!usenet.coe.montana.edu!giac1.oscs.montana.edu!uesu03
- From: uesu03@giac1.oscs.montana.edu (Lou Glassy)
- Subject: Re: first-year programming languages
- Message-ID: <1992Nov16.161631.2334@coe.montana.edu>
- Keywords: n
- Sender: usenet@coe.montana.edu (USENET News System)
- Organization: Montana State University, Bozeman MT
- References: <aelman.721693402@Xenon.Stanford.EDU> <dnebing-141192140340@m64-143.bgsu.edu> <92320.183138BJ020000@NDSUVM1.BITNET>
- Distribution: na
- Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1992 16:16:31 GMT
- Lines: 58
-
- [much deleted]
-
- !(Sorry I lost the originator of this paragraph)..
- !
- !I'm curious as to what other people think about this.. 99% of the programs
- !my CS teacher gave to me were like what the above paragraph is describing..
- !All we had to do was take a program, either given in the book or in class,
- !and make a few changes.. That was the assignment.
- !
- !I don't believe this is a very good way to teach. It doesn't promote
- !any origanility (sp) and creativity.. How can you learn how to program by
- !yourself if all you do is change a few lines of code?
-
- Good question. I don't have a good answer. The process here (MSU) is
- to give the students a problem specification, from which they must develop
- a design. Their designs are graded, and then a correct design is posted,
- which the students use (or they can use their own one, if they choose) to
- implement a solution in [FORTRAN|C|Pascal] {depending on what language
- course they're taking in conjunction with the design course.
-
- !When you get a real job, most of the code you will write is going to be
- !from scratch.. Granted there is going to be times when you modify existing
- !code, but how can you create your OWN code when all you've been taught to
- !do is modify someone else's.
-
- When you get a Real Job... I think most people will *not* be writing fresh
- code, but will spend *most* of their time adapting old code to meet new
- needs. My small experience even here (in the academic bubble) reflects
- this...
-
- !I tutor the programming languages they teach here, and I can really tell that
- !most of this teacher's student's are not good programmers at all. They don't
- !have even basic concepts such as modules (Modula-2 type) and ATD's. To me,
- !it is really frustrating to see this happening. I transferred here from a
- !school that made us write totally original programs, and I think that's the
- !best way to go.
-
- I understand and share your frustration. The curriculum here was skewed in
- the direction you describe above. Happily, it's changing, and I think the
- students coming out nowadays have a stronger grasp of the essential software
- engineering issues.
-
- !Any comments?
-
- Just one more: the dichotomy between computer scientists and programmers
- is not likely to go away. In the best of all worlds, both of these
- elements would be stressed in equal measure (IMHO).
-
- !Dave Mueller
- !bj020000@vm1.nodak.edu
-
- Lou.
-
- --
- Lou Glassy (uesu03@giac1.oscs.montana.edu) Watch the field behind the plow
- Earth Sciences Department Turn to straight, dark rows
- Montana State University Put another season's promise
- Bozeman, Montana 59715 USA In the ground... --Stan Rogers
-