Bisexual dilema


NrrdGrrl! Discussion Forum: Just Plain Talk: Bisexual dilema
By Frustrated Female on Friday, February 27, 1998 - 11:57 pm:

I'm a bisexual female and live with my partner, who is male. Every time I start to become friends with a woman, if she's a lesbian, as soon as she discovers my relationship, she's not interested in communicating with me anymore. I feel like she thinks I'm not part of the "club" anymore. Am I just a freak? Just because I am with a man right now does not mean I'm heterosexual. Besides, isn't this whole thing supposed to be about love, and not whether you've got an innie or an outie in between your legs?


By Shampoo on Saturday, February 28, 1998 - 03:57 am:

Do you mean talking as in friendship, or just like a potential girlfriend? Cuz if you're just talking to her as a friend, and she goes all weird just because you're involved with a male, thats not exactly nice, just ignore them. It's not your problem, it's theirs.

But if it was like a potential relationship, then I guess I can kinda understand, cuz if I was interested in a guy, but I found out that he was bisexual and living with another guy, I wouldn't go out with him. I'm sorry if it sounds mean, but I have my restrictions, so I guess I understand where these girls are coming from. For them, it's weird to be involved with a man, so they wouldn't, you know? That didn't come out right, but... I guess... my advice to you is to stick with whoever you love, and ignore whoever pisses you off, there you go.


By Shampoo on Saturday, February 28, 1998 - 03:59 am:

Oh, but that doesn't mean that she couldn't be just friends with you, or anything!! That's mean, not to talk to you just cuz you're with a man. That's like discrimination.


By Lally on Friday, March 13, 1998 - 07:00 pm:

Does anybody know that God said it is wrong to have sex with the same sex? Does anybody care?



By Titania on Friday, March 13, 1998 - 11:29 pm:

Um actually, unless you are Jewish and are under the old covenant (The covenant of Abraham in the Old Testament) of God...Jesus says absolutely nothing about homosexuality...nothing...look in in all four gospels of the new testament and you will find NOTHING!!! Paul mentions it, but it we did everything Paul said was profitable, women could not speak in church and there heads would have to covered at all times. Also, the onlu thing tha would make homosexuality a sin is that it is often sex outside of marriage because our puritan government will not permit same sex marriages. Before you condemn someones lifestyle and use the Bible as your back up, have your Bible knowledge straight.


By Shampoo on Saturday, March 14, 1998 - 01:31 am:

Hey, if I wasn't a nice person, I'd take offence to that, Titania!! Just because you believe differently doesn't mean everyone else "doesn't have their bible knowledge straight". Lally is right, it does say *in the bible* that homosexuality is wrong. It doesn't have to be repeated in the new testament for it to still be in place. The whole *Bible* is for people, not just the new or old testament. So what does that mean then? Only Jewish homosexuals are condemned by God? Besides, God did create a man and woman for each other, that's the way he intended it to be. Homosexuality goes against him. There are a set of absolutes in the bible. You shouldn't kill, you shouldn't steal, commit adultary, etc etc. If the New Testament didn't say that would it mean it would be okay?

Frustrated Female, no offense to you. I like to have an open mind and not get into arguments with other grrls. This site isn't to make others feel bad, so that's why I didn't say anything before. But since Lally and Titania brought it up, I thought I should add what I have to say.


By Lee on Saturday, March 14, 1998 - 08:54 am:

Hey, as Titania pointed out, you can find references in the bible that say women are inferior. Does that mean equality & even this very website, etc. go "against him?"

My advice to anyone who has that attitude to gay, bi or lesbian people is to realize you don't necessarily know as much about the people around you as you think you know. Within the last year or so, one of my cousins & two of my friends have come out. There wasn't an Ellen factor w/this as all but one happened before the she came out on the show & that was only because he didn't want to tell me he was bi by e-mail, he wanted to do it in person & we live in different states.

For all you know, you could be hurting someone you care about a lot by saying these type of things. Think about it, do you realy want to alienate a friend or relative & make them feel alone at the very time they need your love & support?


By Lee on Saturday, March 14, 1998 - 09:07 am:

PS to my last message--Another issue, how do we even know if God has a gender, let alone what it is?

Also, when it comes to religion, it's interesting to note that as it got more organized, it became more patriarchal. If you'd like to read more about this & basically just an overall good survey of women's history, I'd recommend Beyond Power: On Women, Men & Morals by Marilyn French.


By Titania on Saturday, March 14, 1998 - 12:09 pm:

Ok, first of all, that post was not meant offend, but to inform. Secondly, actually, if you are a Christian...and believe in Jesus Christ...this is what i am talking about...the Old Testament does not apply to you. As a Christian you are under the new covenant of salvation and there are only two laws given...one being "Love the Lord your God with all you heart, soul, and strength" And the other being "Love your neighbor as youself." Thos camandments and laws of the new testament do not apply. How many christian people do you know that fallow kosher laws? I don't know many and the new covenant is the reason.


By Anonymous on Saturday, March 14, 1998 - 06:01 pm:

OK, girls...let's stop speaking from the "moral high ground" on this topic! I'm sure this is not helping the orginal person who posed the question! Many women may wish to explore their sexuality at some point in their life...that's a good thing. Other people making judgements about it only complicates the journey. The Bible is a very old, and often mis-translated and mis-interpreted document. What's more important is your personal relationship with your God and other people. Let try more to support and care for one another instead of making judgements.


By Shampoo on Monday, March 16, 1998 - 05:45 pm:

Look, i'm not the only person who feels that way, okay? I follow what the bible says, not only the new testament but the old testament, and what God originally wanted for us, which is man and woman living together. I'm not saying being homosexual is wrong, but I'm saying that the *act* is. Sure you can go and say that times have changed, the bible is old, etc etc, but the bible is the bible, and you can't change it around to suit what *you* think is right.


By Lee on Monday, March 16, 1998 - 08:36 pm:

Shampoo,

Before this one exchange, I had a lot of respect for your postings, but I really feel the need to say something about the postings you've sent on this topic.

Well, what about "be fruitful & multiply"? Does this mean women who don't want children are "going against him"? I'm not exactly a bible scholar, but there are some things in there which aren't exactly progressive toward women. Are you going to go along with that? How about when people argue w/their parents? There's a commandment about "honoring your parents". Are they "going against him"?

Titania,

I'm a religion class dropout, but I was raised semi-Catholic & I do seem to recall that the 10 commandments, etc. were still in effect for Christians. The "love thy neighbor as yourself" is probably a paraphrase of "do onto others as you would have others do onto to you" which is commonly referred to as The Golden Rule & the "Judeo-Christian" ethic. Most of the Islamic, Buddhist & just about every other group of people I know seem to go along w/this too, so I hesitate to confine this common sense, wonderful advice to just 2 religions.

Everyone who's had the patience to read this far,
I'm no saint either when it comes to having an open mind. I've said some stupid things I've later regretted, that's why I wrote about how you never know the people around you as well as you think you do. Keep it mind, you don't want to hurt the friends and relatives you love. I've done it in the past & I'd give everything to go back & change it.


By ZoOeY on Tuesday, March 17, 1998 - 02:46 am:

Even the bible condemns homosexuality, pride is ALSO a sin. Therefore, if you degrade the concept of homosexuality, you are illustrating that you are far more superior and better than them, which clearly passes off as pride and being arrogant is sinful. I shouldn't question the Bible, but the Bible is not the only foundation that holds its own principles. Religions all over the world somehow differ when it comes to the controversy of sexuality. I'm a strong advocate of sexuality, whether it's "straight" or "gay/lesbian/bi" because my little speculative theory states that love can be deep that gender doesn't really matter. Does anyone knows what gender God is? What if God does not even have one? How are we supposed to know all the answers? We can only take the Bible into context and try to understands its poetic wisdom.

One more thing. We no longer strive to live as a Puritan government. It died in the 1920's, when urbanization was born and leisure activities including radio and motion pictures became glamourously popular. Family values went down the drain and the social influence of peers was extremely critical, since children started to go to school at longer times. Frankly, I cannot even comprehend that the era we hail from is even halfway close to being an utopian society the Puritans dreamt of. In other words, yeah, we're screwed-up because there is more corruption and the prohibition of alcohol died a long time ago.

About your bisexual dilemma, you should not consider yourself a freak in a negative way. It's cool to be individualistic and unique, but it can be a pain in the butt. If your new friend cannot accept the fact you live with a man under intimate and personal circumstances, then it is not worth it because it implies that she doesn't really trust you as a friend. Lesbians can be conservative, but they should try to keep an open mind towards bi-sexual (I know.. "too straight to think according to the gay community" and "too queer to think according to the straight community") but don't let this dilemma discourage you from trying again in the future. Love is a drug. Many people fail to see the deep surface of love. It's beyond comprehenisble and complex and your new friend probably was being unfair and biased because of your bisexuality. I think she refuses to accept the way you are and that plain sucks.


By Lynda on Tuesday, March 17, 1998 - 06:07 pm:

cant we all get along?


By Kat on Wednesday, March 18, 1998 - 09:39 pm:

Yes Lynda, we CAN get along..if we get back to the problem at hand. Frustrated Female asked our advice, NOT our moral judgement. If any of you are against what she or anyone else beleives in or practices, then ignore it..don't try to push your beleifs where they aren't wanted.
and P.S. Jesus may have died for someone's sins, but he didn't die for mine.


By Seaweed on Sunday, March 22, 1998 - 10:36 pm:

all of that did nothing but make me sad. Our community spends entirely too much time fighting over who's God is right. I like to hope that we were put here to be human and to love one another. Since we ARE all human, we differ in many ways; I really wish we could respect & love each others differences.

The original problem at hand... grrl, you'll find you're nitch, it's out there somewhere. No REAL friend of yours would throw you out the window for being who you are. Women are difficult, though. I understand your dilemma. Just keep in mind, you're not alone and there are other women out there who are just like you.

I won't sit here and argue with people about the bible. It's interpreted differently by all of us. I don't agree with most of what was said, but I know that doesn't make ANYONE wrong.

My last note... I love women. I'm proud of my life, and I'm happy. I'm a good human being; loving, honest, sincere, I pay my taxes, and I help in the community. I haven't hurt anyone. Lastly, MY God would not judge me nearly as harshly as some of the people around me.


By Lee on Monday, March 23, 1998 - 07:51 pm:

Seaweed, your post was the best post on this whole topic.


By Lily on Sunday, March 29, 1998 - 08:49 pm:

and BACK to the topic:

i just recently had an experience like frustrated female's. i was a women's party, and found myself (and my *female* date) ostrasized because we both happen to be well known in our community to have male partners. both of us.

someone told me once that if a woman can have an orgasm with another woman, then she gets to be part of the club.

end of story.

lily


By Trollybean on Tuesday, April 7, 1998 - 08:49 pm:

i think that so many people misunderstand bisexuality, or they refuse to believe it exists...they believe you ahve to be one or the other...but you don't...and most psychology books will explain this phenomenon. i think frustrated female was dealing with a very unenlightened individual...i hope that she can find someone who will love...not because of who she will and can fall in love with, but because of her inner beauty...
Why cant we just ignore the external parts and focus on the inner being and its compliments. I feel that as long as two people compliment each other...that is all that matters.


By TANK_GRRLY on Wednesday, April 8, 1998 - 09:25 pm:

Excuse me,Lally,I don't mean to bash your belifes,but if "God" is supposed to be loving and forgiving,he should love all people,regardless of who they choose to have a relationship with.I am proud to be bisexual,and I love people because of what kind of person they are,not because of what they have between their legs.I'm sorry,but if I'm supposed to be condemmed to hell because I had sex with some one that I loved,and they happened to be the same gender as me,them fuck it!


By Butch on Tuesday, April 14, 1998 - 11:10 am:

Wow. This was quite a discussion to come upon for my first time on the nrrdgrrl page. As an out lesbian and an out Christian, I feel I must respond, both to the original message and to the biblical debate.

Frustrated Female: I'm sorry you had to encounter this sort of bigotry, which really reflects badly on the lesbian community. I guess the idea behind this is that some feel bisexuality is a cop-out, in that you enjoy heterosexual priviledge while soaking up the culture of the queer community. Personally, I don't see this. Among my friends who are bisexual, those who are with a man do not make any effort to hide their bisexuality, and that's a pretty brave thing to do around here. All this priviledge stuff aside, who are we to question someone else's identity?

As for the biblical debate, I feel that I have done enough research to speak on this. As I understand it, the Bible as we know it has been translated numerous times, from Hebrew to Latin to English and so on. Much has been lost in translation, and much as been misrepresented as well. In the most recent version of the Bible in English, I could probably argue against all six verses which have been said to condemn homosexuality. However, it seems like this issue has been debated enough here, so if anyone would like to discuss this further, please email me privately:

00181044@bigred.unl.edu


By Gemini on Saturday, April 25, 1998 - 01:21 am:

i think i am bisexual - i mean, live with my common-law husband and play the fucking hetero - but SOMETHING SOMEWHERE is really wrong - i need some advice - i need to find someone who has been through this shit - my husband would NEVER understand about something like this - i feel like i am honestly going a little crazy - i think about women QUITE a bit, more than usual, i suspect - anyone have any advice at all out there?? please?


By Anonymous on Saturday, April 25, 1998 - 04:43 pm:

I am in a relationship with a guy, but I also have a few girls I know who I find VERY attractive. I can't imagine leaving my boyfriend for someone of ANY gender, but if we were to ever break up, does this attraction to other females mean that i am a bi-sexual, or just a teenager "confused about her sexuality"? Only like two or three people in the world who actually know me have ever heard about this (my boyfriend is not one of them) and they all most likely think that i am over my "stage" (i have not talked to anyone about this since before school started again). Does anyone kind of know what i am going through?


By Unt_ on Sunday, April 26, 1998 - 09:50 pm:

Ok...I'm sure we've beat this to death...the 10 commandments say nothing about Homosexuality. There is a part where this guy says "one man shall not lie with another man" stuff, but *everything* else this guy said is now completely disregarded. In the same passage he said that "thou shalt not eat raw meat, touch a woman when she is unclean (menstruating), shave, eat pork (hello? christians couldn't hold back on that tasty stuff, could ya...way to go Jewish people!!), and the most abusrd--thou shalt not wear clothing made of 2 different fabrics (otherwise...next time you pull on that cotton/poly blend t-shirt-think again--you'll go to hell if you do). So for some reason, y'all forget the rest. The Sodom & Gamorrah stuff was not sex...but rape--it was to degrade those men...*not* love for sure. You are all just scared of things you do not understand.


By Shannon on Monday, April 27, 1998 - 02:50 pm:

Finally! Someone who's *read* the Bible has something to say! Thank you, Unt! What a breath of fresh air....


By Dolly38 on Monday, April 27, 1998 - 03:47 pm:

I am 44 yo white female who is very bi.You need to
be with other bi women who are mature enough to
understand your feelings and not to judge.I can tell you from personal experience were out there.


By Trollybean on Monday, April 27, 1998 - 06:17 pm:

no offense, but i think that titania was basically saying the same thing as Unt was...both of which i agree.

now for my story...

My former best friend(MEW) got me to come out to her at which time i found out that she was also bi...
we never started any kind of physical relationship, but could have. i had a boyfriend then and was very confused...i felt closer to her than just about anyone. I finally talked to another good friend of mine who was like my big brother...i trusted him. He gave me good advice and i stayed with my boyfriend whom i love more than the world...but he jokingl said something to one of his friends about my former best friend and i. The person he joked with told his girlfriend...who turned it into a lesbian sexual encounter...the rumor continued to spread without me knowing... The rumor reached the ears of my MEW and hell began. she flipped out and told everone that i started the rumor...she was afraid everyone would find out the truth about her, so she turned everything around. It was horrible, i had people who i thought were my friends saying really nasty things about me behind my back. I have apologized to my exbest friend for what part i may or may not have had in it...but she still refuses to speak to me and i have heard that she hates me! She knows the truth, she knows exactly what i told my other friend, but she has to cover her butt by killing me from the inside out...
I would do anything to have her speak to me again. I am asking for punishment i suppose, but i want her friendship back.
i'm sorry to ramble on but i want to share my story.


By Anonymous on Tuesday, April 28, 1998 - 04:10 pm:

People take the bible too literally.


By Eliste on Tuesday, April 28, 1998 - 04:31 pm:

I completely agree Anonymous
I think many of the teachings are helpful but it is a guide not law


By Shannon on Friday, May 1, 1998 - 01:31 pm:

You're right, Trollybean... I'm sorry. What I wrote was really rude... I just get extremely defensive when it comes to religion and sexuality. The reason is, well, I try to be a really, really good person, and sometimes it works. I went to go get my boyfriend's paycheck cashed a few days ago, and they gave me $100 too much. And you know what? I gave it back. We're going to have to sell plasma to be able to make the rent this month, but I gave that $100 back because it was the right thing to do. And then someone says that I'm bad, or going to hell because I'm bisexual? That just really, really hurts me.... but, anyway, sorry if I offended anybody or anything. :)


By Trollybean on Friday, May 1, 1998 - 06:56 pm:

You offended no one shannon! Gosh, you really are an awsome person! I am personally really hurt not only by misconceptions about the Bible, but also about the rumors people start. The horrible rumor i earlier described has left me the horrible dying feeling and also lead to the destruction of a wonderful friendship!


By Deborah (Crazemink) on Tuesday, May 5, 1998 - 05:02 pm:

For those who are looking to get information about bisexuality, or just folks to talk to: check out http://www.qrd.org/qrd/www/orgs/brc/brl-toc.html . This lists many on-line resources, and can hopefully lead you to the info you need. Enjoy!


By Trollybean on Tuesday, May 5, 1998 - 05:37 pm:

thanks deborah... life gets so confusing!


By Anonymous on Monday, May 11, 1998 - 04:08 pm:

This is just to say to all bisexuals that I think you shouldn't be hassled by anyone just because of what you are!I completely agree with you and think you should be respected just for coming out in the first place!


By Laurel on Thursday, May 14, 1998 - 09:00 pm:

I don't practice a specific religion. Like I don't go to church or anything. But I do believe in Jesus and he loved everyone so I don't think being gay or bi is wrong.


By Anonymous on Sunday, May 24, 1998 - 04:06 pm:

being bi-sexual is sometimes a very confusing position to be in. I am 17, and last year i decided to try to find myself. i met a bi sexual girl who was interested in me, unfortunaly i had a boyfriend who i really loved. but i had to find myself, and i did. my boyfriend hated it, and i ruined our realationship for quite a while, as he felt jealous. i have since decided to stick to one or the other, but i do not regret all the hell i when through to find myself.


By Rhyanna on Wednesday, September 2, 1998 - 11:48 pm:

Dear Frustrated Female,

I think I know what you are talking about. Not including the possibility that the gay women you meet may be rejecting you as a potential date, etc...I know the whole business of being rejected for being bi. There is the questioning our loyalty, our integrity, etc...As if somehow, there is less to be said about the quality of our women-women relationships because sometimes we are with a man.

I think the best thing you can do is revel in your bi identity. There will always, sadly enough, be some gay women who use the same kind of prejudism they loathe on us. Find some women who do support you, read bi literature, join a bi support group, or talk to other bi women on line to feed a healthy sense of identity. And remember, when all else fails "kill 'em with kindness"! Hurtful remarks or behaviour aren't appropriate for anyone over 13 years old, but they lose their oomph when you ignore them or smile it off. You may not notice it at the time, but other women (who may later be good friends, etc.)will pick up on this behaviour and remember your class act.


By Barbie girl gone bad on Thursday, October 8, 1998 - 07:59 pm:

Well, I'm bisexual, and so is this girl I'm really good friends with. I was going to date her but I have a boyfriend and I'm really in love with him, so it just doesn't seem right to be with anyone else. My point is that maybe these people who don't want to be with you because you have a boyfriend feel the same way about it as I do.


By Thora on Saturday, November 7, 1998 - 05:36 pm:

Lally,

did it ever occur to you that not everyone believes in God?


By Little_Ms_Smartypants on Sunday, November 8, 1998 - 02:10 pm:

Hello Guys!
Frustrated Female has not posted on this sight for like 6 Months!!!!!
But I guess that doesn't matter,hey?
I am Agnostic and (straight) but I totally sympathise with what Bi/lesbian women have to go through as my best friend is Bi.
I think all the Bible stuff has nothing to do with the issue.(sorry if I have offended anyone)and everyone should lay off it.


By Celia Gardner on Tuesday, November 10, 1998 - 08:46 am:

I am very worried about admitting it, as I am in the college computer room and any homophobe (bi - phobe?) could read this over my shoulder, but I am bisexual.

Phew, I said it.

I feel left out in a group of straight people AND a group of gay people. I write this and people are walking past and I feel very nervous. Please help.


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