Day 036 - 13 Oct 94 - Page 54


     
     1   Q.   You said that is about as strong language as you can get,
     2        I believe you said, from the Surgeon General?
     3        A.  Yes.  I would have been amazed for him to have said
     4        anything stronger even in the face of very, very strong
     5        evidence of a causal relationship.
     6
     7   Q.   Another sentence that was read out before was the World
     8        Health Organisation conclusions.  I will not refer the
     9        court to the document again.  It was on page 197 of the
    10        1990 report, but I will read out the first sentence
    11        again:  "Dietary factors are now known", my emphasis, "to
    12        influence the development", my emphasis, "of a wide range
    13        of chronic diseases" and that included cancers.  What is
    14        your conclusion from that very carefully chosen, no doubt,
    15        sentence or phrase?
    16        A.  It seems quite clear to me that they are saying there
    17        is a very great deal of evidence that we are far beyond
    18        the point of links between diet and chronic disease being
    19        simply associations, speculations or suspicions; that
    20        indeed, many of these relationships are well established
    21        and, among them, relationships between diet and breast and
    22        colon cancer.
    23
    24   Q.   But the World Health Organisation say "known", "dietary
    25        factors are now known"; is that stronger than you would
    26        put it may be?
    27
    28   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  You are really giving the evidence for him,
    29        are you not?
    30
    31   MR. MORRIS:  OK.  Mr. Rampton did emphasis that particular
    32        phrase and went it into detail.
    33        A.  To respond to the question that you put me just
    34        briefly, it is not stronger than, I would say.  I think
    35        that in the discussion of diet and cancer as it occurs at
    36        scientific conferences all the time and has occurred,
    37        perhaps in this courtroom, we talk about epidemiology
    38        where there are areas of ongoing disagreement.  But when
    39        one looks at certain other links, there are things that
    40        clearly are known, that a diet that is high-in-fat and
    41        high in sugar which are the most concentrated calorie wise
    42        nutrients possible is known to increase the likelihood of
    43        obesity, the risks of obesity.  Obesity is known to
    44        increase the risk of breast cancer.  So, it is quite safe
    45        to say that, yes, dietary factors are known to increase
    46        the risks of chronic disease, among them cancer, that
    47        being one of those links; there are many.
    48
    49        That tends to sometimes not enter into the discussion that
    50        we are talking about the epidemiologic data.  I guess I 
    51        have emphasised that quite a number of times. 
    52 
    53   Q.   I think there are just a couple more questions.
    54        Mr. Rampton at the very beginning of his evidence all
    55        those days ago produced a packet of Gitanes.
    56
    57   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I do not think it was his evidence, in
    58        fairness to him.
    59
    60   MR. MORRIS:  Sorry, his cross-examination -- maybe it was his

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