Day 256 - 04 Jun 96 - Page 40
1 medical structure. So, we had those data; and it is
2 impressively good -- much better than I had thought
3 originally.
4
5 Q. You say better than you had thought; but as good, better
6 than?
7 A. Yes, I would say nearly as good as; in fact, in some
8 cases, such as liver cancer, stomach cancer, maybe better,
9 because they are so familiar with those diseases.
10
11 Q. We are not here concerned with either of those cancers,
12 but, as you know, we are concerned with cancer, if you
13 like, colorectal cancer and cancer of the breast. So the
14 availability of chemotherapy and radiotherapy is as good in
15 the Peoples Republic of China, and has been for what we
16 might say 40 years, as in the United States?
17 A. Well, I think that is a leading question because, quite
18 clearly -----
19
20 Q. It is a leading question, yes.
21 A. That is leading question, because one makes a
22 presumption that the use of radiotherapy and chemotherapy
23 is sort of the golden standard for cancer cure, cancer
24 control, when in fact the data do not support that. The
25 Chinese take a rather different view on some of those
26 issues. They use their own sort of procedures; and at this
27 point in time, when we look at the data we have been using
28 in the West with regard to that, it is not very pleasing to
29 see the results. So I am not sure that we can start out
30 with that presumption.
31
32 Q. I know you are not a medical man, and I certainly am not,
33 but you know more about it than I do. Can I take cancer of
34 the colon, for example?
35 A. Yes.
36
37 Q. It is one of the cancers which, in the Western world at
38 least, has responded well to the forms of treatment which
39 are available, including surgery -- comparatively well?
40 A. It is somewhat debatable. One of the -- the principal
41 debate primarily has to do with the time when the disease
42 is actually diagnosed. We get ever better at diagnosing
43 early disease. It looks like we are improving the sort of
44 prognosis when, in fact, all we are doing is just moving
45 the early diagnosis date up; so then, when we look five
46 years later, we have not really improved on our ability to
47 control or cure the disease.
48
49 Q. But, none the worst for that, I dare say, early diagnosis
50 is as beneficial or perhaps more so than what one might
51 call later therapy?
52 A. That is the part that is somewhat debatable, because
53 early diagnosis does not necessarily mean a longer life; it
54 only means we have a longer period to sort of look at the
55 disease, if you will.
56
57 Q. But am I right or wrong in thinking that as compared with,
58 for example, stomach cancer, colorectal cancer is more
59 susceptible of cure -- to use a simple English word -- than
60 stomach cancer?
