Day 120 - 03 May 95 - Page 62


     
     1        you go there".
     2
     3   Q.   Okay.  The crew could not just work that out amongst
     4        themselves; they would have to ask someone?
     5        A.  They might very well at times, at low volume times,
     6        there will not necessarily be a Manager on that area, and
     7        Charlie will say:  "Brian, can you watch me for five
     8        minutes?" and he will run to the toilet.
     9
    10   Q.   So, if someone was disciplined or sacked for -----
    11
    12   MR. RAMPTON:  My Lord I must intervene at this stage because
    13        I observe that Mr. Shaw is not one of the Defendants'
    14        witnesses.  The only evidence about this particular
    15        instance comes from the Plaintiff's side.  There is no
    16        evidence at all that this has ever happened.  So, one needs
    17        to be a little bit cautious of that, bearing in mind what
    18        the Court of Appeal said, of course.
    19
    20   MR. MORRIS:  I hope Mr. Rampton is not going to jump up every
    21        time I go through these pleadings and tell the witness what
    22        he should say.
    23
    24   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  It rather depends what you are going
    25        to  -----
    26
    27   MR. MORRIS:  I am going to object strongly -----
    28
    29   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Are you not going to be asking me what
    30        I think of this when one sees what evidence we have at the
    31        end of the day?
    32
    33   MR. MORRIS:  Yes.
    34
    35   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  This is what I was trying to express before
    36        the break, really, just how productive it is to ask
    37        Mr. Nicholson because, with every respect to Mr. Nicholson,
    38        I listen to what people say their attitude to practices
    39        are, but once one can see what incidents have be
    40        established, I am going to be pig-headed enough to form my
    41        own view as to whether that is bad enough to justify what
    42        may be said in the leaflet which relates to it, really.
    43
    44        You see, it does not matter one way or the other, if
    45        Mr. Nicholson does not disapprove of something, I might,
    46        nevertheless, disapprove of it; if Mr. Nicholson does
    47        disapprove of something, I might think:  "Well, that is a
    48        bit of a storm in a teacup".  You really want to establish
    49        your facts.
    50 
    51        The first thing, I would have thought, is to ask 
    52        Mr. Nicholson if he knows anything about a Jeffrey Shaw of 
    53        King Street.  I anticipate his answer probably is going to
    54        be "no", but that is your first question.  It is quite
    55        right that you should ask what the procedures are if
    56        someone wants to go to the loo when they are working.  You
    57        have done that.  (To the witness):  Do you know anything
    58        about Jeffrey Shaw, Mr. Nicholson?
    59        A.  I knew nothing until I was asked to enquire into this,
    60        nothing at all.

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