Day 171 - 11 Oct 95 - Page 39


     
     1        dealt with everything else.  I hope I have.  Our problem
     2        there, I believe, is a somewhat different one.  Whereas it
     3        may be that notes of rap sessions (of which your Lordship
     4        has one specimen already) give an indication of the kinds
     5        of questions which the Company thinks it important to ask,
     6        a big question, we would suggest, is: how much help does
     7        your Lordship derive from seeing the answers, whether they
     8        are answers at Bath or at Putney or at Sidcup or at Epsom,
     9        or wherever else in the country or, indeed, the world one
    10        might like to think of?  The reason for that is
    11        straightforward:  the rap sessions take place maybe twice a
    12        year -- in some places less often, I think, and some places
    13        more often.  They are conducted by an outsider to the
    14        restaurant.  They involve maybe ten, sometimes fewer,
    15        sometimes more, members of the crew at any given time.  The
    16        members of the crew are anonymous so far as the restaurant
    17        is concerned.  One wonders what assistance the Defendants
    18        can derive, since the notes of the rap session, as opposed
    19        to the questions, are not and can never be evidence
    20        admissible against the Plaintiffs, whatever they might say.
    21
    22   MR. JUSTICE BELL: Yes.  I will essentially look at the
    23        application on the basis of whether Mr. Morris, speaking
    24        for himself and Ms. Steel, is invited to have discovery,
    25        but I have also, as it is apparent from what I have said,
    26        seen whether it might help me anyway.  One of the
    27        allegations which is made against McDonald's is that the
    28        system is such that the employees are too cowed to raise
    29        any kind of complaint, or that it is just not the way of
    30        the world for the foot soldiers to go around complaining
    31        about the NCOs and commissioned officers; they do not do
    32        that.
    33
    34   MR. RAMPTON:  Can I help by -----
    35
    36   MR. JUSTICE BELL: It occurs to me that it might be useful in one
    37        way or another; it might help Mr. Morris in some way by the
    38        Peruvian Guano test, at least; for all I know, it would
    39        help McDonald's.  I just do not know.  It would be rather
    40        interesting to see them, that is all.
    41
    42   MR. RAMPTON:  I am not sure your Lordship's first proposition is
    43        right, that it would help Mr. Morris by the Peruvian Guano
    44        test, for the very reason that there is no identity given
    45        to the people.  So he really hits the buffers there.  That
    46        is why I say they cannot and never could become admissible
    47        as evidence, because it could never be a witness.  That is
    48        the first thing.
    49
    50        I am not so much concerned about that.  Can I help 
    51        your Lordship to make a decision about this.  Once again, 
    52        although I believe that I have a decent legal argument why 
    53        these are not disclosable, since no true relevance has been
    54        demonstrated for them, at the same time my very strong
    55        feeling is that wherever possible I would like to help
    56        your Lordship with as much material as I can, and as
    57        I think I have done throughout the case, to reach a proper
    58        conclusion.  Can I therefore reveal a few of my cards?
    59        I have read the rap session notes for 1993, 1994 and 1995
    60        at Bath; and I add 1995 for a reason.  What you find is, if

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