Day 030 - 03 Oct 94 - Page 35


     
     1        extent in the States.  There is a limit, of course, as to
     2        what you can do with products like that.
     3
     4   Q.   The question I am asking is, if a company says they
     5        support recommendations on healthy eating, what does that
     6        mean in practice to you?
     7        A.  Well, it would depend on the company.
     8
     9   Q.   As a public health policy expression?
    10        A.  It would depend on the product of the firm.  If the
    11        firm in question was producing products whose nutritional
    12        profile was clearly unhealthy, as judged in this case by
    13        government, and that firm said it supported the views, in
    14        this case, of the health of the nation, then I would
    15        expect they would be seeking to do something practical to
    16        change the quality of the food, given that it is the food
    17        firm, the food that they manufactured or distributed or
    18        sold, whatever.  Do you wish me to apply this to
    19        McDonald's particularly?
    20
    21   Q.   We do not have to now go into whether McDonald's food is
    22         ----
    23
    24   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  What Professor Wheelock said, or one of the
    25        things he said was that there is a limited extent to which
    26        you can expect a significant part of the population to
    27        change their diet just because they read it would be
    28        sensible to do so.  A significant part of the population
    29        may not have read, however widely publicised it is.  A
    30        good way of doing that is to see if those who provide the
    31        food for them to eat at the outlets which they choose to
    32        use can make changes in their own food.  Of course, they
    33        have to make the changes so as not to defer their
    34        customers from coming to their outlets to eat it or their
    35        stores to buy it.  What McDonald's has sought to do in
    36        certain instances is to change the ingredients without the
    37        customer actually -----?
    38        A.  Noticing.
    39
    40   Q.   Appreciating that the flavour has changed.
    41        A.  Yes.
    42
    43   Q.   So it is just as palatable.
    44        A.  Yes, and they are doing that in common with other
    45        manufacturers as well, which need not be mentioned here.
    46        As an anecdote, I remember that Professor Sushma Palmer,
    47        who was director of the National Academy of Sciences, Food
    48        and Nutrition Board at the time of these two major reports
    49        were produced, happens to be married to the Hungarian
    50        Ambassador, or the American who was the American 
    51        Ambassador to Hungary until recently, Mark Palmer.  She 
    52        addressed with him a large conference in Budapest not so 
    53        long ago with which McDonald's was concerned.  She stated
    54        she would be very unhappy to do that in her position
    55        unless and until McDonald's were prepared to serve salads
    56        in all their restaurants.  Whether or not that happened
    57        throughout Hungary, and indeed how many outlets McDonald's
    58        have in Hungary I do not know.
    59
    60        The point I am making from that anecdote is that a firm

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