Day 146 - 03 Jul 95 - Page 32


     
     1        far because we have not been able to put our hands on
     2        anything we think the Defendants ought to be seeing.  We
     3        may have missed something.  It does not mean to say there
     4        is nothing at all.
     5
     6   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Can you tell me what the position is if your
     7        list would have nothing on it?  Does the affidavit just
     8        say, "There are no documents, therefore we cannot make a
     9        list of them"?  I have never had this situation before.
    10
    11   MR. ATKINSON:   I suppose we would not serve a list but we would
    12        do the affidavit.
    13
    14   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I am just thinking of what the Defendants
    15        might do.
    16
    17   MR. ATKINSON:  Quite frankly ----
    18
    19   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  You cannot have a list with nothing on it,
    20        can you?  That is my only point.
    21
    22   MR. ATKINSON:   No.  If they wanted to do it in a form of an
    23        affidavit saying, "There are no documents under this
    24        particular head", fine.
    25
    26   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  You either want a list verified by affidavit
    27        or a very short affidavit saying, "There are no documents
    28        which are relevant to these matter"?
    29
    30   MR. ATKINSON:   Yes.  We are more concerned with the affidavit
    31        than the list.
    32
    33   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Yes, very well.
    34
    35   MR. ATKINSON:  My Lord, there are, no doubt, Further and Better
    36        Particulars in relation to that issue, but they are not
    37        important in the way they were for issues (c) and (d)
    38        because they were actually brought up in the Further and
    39        Better Particulars, those issues (c) and (d).  That is why
    40        we actually referred to demonstrations and fairs.  For
    41        these purposes one only need look at the Defence to
    42        Counterclaim to see there is an issue.  I do not know
    43        whether if I took your Lordship, I think I probably have
    44        not, to the Defence to Counterclaim to show where we deal
    45        with this particular meaning.  That is on page 3 of the
    46        Defence to Counterclaim at (c) which is our Lucas-Box
    47        meaning.
    48
    49   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  In the defence to counterclaim paragraph 7
    50        subparagraph (c) that is where the ignoring starts. 
    51 
    52   MR. ATKINSON:   That is right.  So that is our Lucas-Box 
    53        paragraph.  Then the particulars ----
    54
    55   MS. STEEL:   Sorry.  We have heard of Lucas-Box before, but I am
    56        not 100 per cent sure what is meant ----
    57
    58   MR. ATKINSON:   It is quite wrong of me to talk in those terms.
    59        I will explain it.  That is the meaning that the Second
    60        Plaintiff is seeking to justify.  Then on page 9 of that

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