Day 020 - 28 Jul 94 - Page 31


     
     1
         Q.   OK, but it is not something you think is humane?
     2        A.  I would not recommend it, no.
 
     3   Q.   What are your views on decapitation?  It does not cause
              instantaneous death, does it?
     4        A.  My view is, from research that we have done using
              chickens and decapitation, that it may not cause
     5        instantaneous insensibility.  Our physiological studies
              show that it does not cause concussive like effects in the
     6        brain.  So, I am seriously concerned that it does not
              cause instantaneous unconsciousness.
     7
         Q.   Right.  How long does it take for brain death after
     8        decapitation?
              A.  In the case of, if you use a criteria of loss of evoke
     9        responses, it is of the order, I believe, of about 90
              seconds, it may be a little more.  That is in one of the
    10        papers; it is that sort of order.
 
    11   Q.   During that time you say your studies have shown the bird
              is not unconscious?
    12        A.  I have not said that they show that; it is a very
              difficult question to answer.  If you have an isolated
    13        head, to enquire from that head whether it is conscious,
              you appreciate. Our physiological studies show it does not
    14        induce concussion in the brain or at least concussive type
              of effect you would expect.  If decapitation is to cause
    15        instantaneous unconsciousness, my argument would be that
              it would have to induce that by a concussive like effect.
    16        We have not observed that.
 
    17   Q.   So decapitation is not something you feel is to be
              recommended?
    18        A.  I would only recommend it in the case of euthanasia
              where there is no alternative, no suitable alternative,
    19        which could be done rapidly.
 
    20   Q.   Otherwise you have concerns about whether it may cause
              some suffering to the bird?
    21        A.  Correct.
 
    22   Q.   Severing the spinal cord without cutting the carotid
              arteries results in death through asphyxia?
    23        A.  Yes.
 
    24   Q.   What is your view, is that something you consider to be
              humane?
    25        A.  If the bird was not adequately stunned, did not remain
              stunned up to the time that it died, then death from 
    26        asphyxia would be an unpleasant death, in my view. 
  
    27   Q.   Death from this method could take quite a few minutes,
              could it not?
    28        A.  Yes, that is given in the histogram we referred to
              earlier.  Yes, it would take quite a few minutes, yes.
    29
         Q.   You cannot remember the length of time between stunning
    30        and neck cutting?
              A.  No.  This is information which I will send back to the

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