Day 309 - 03 Dec 96 - Page 44


     
     1        McDonald's are to blame.
     2
     3   MR. RAMPTON:  I picked that up.  I know it came from
     4        your Lordship originally but, 'they condone the degree of
     5        suffering which ordinary people would regard as
     6        unacceptable'.
     7
     8   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Yes, and there again, purely and simply
     9        because I find it easier to get my mind around these
    10        matters if I write it down, I have written down this as a
    11        possible meaning: it goes further than the Defendants, but
    12        it does not have the utter indifference in.
    13
    14        I am not going to hand down a copy because it comes up in
    15        CaseView anyway.
    16
    17        "The Plaintiffs are culpably responsible for
    18        cruel/inhumane" -- I want to come back to 'cruel' in a
    19        moment -- practices in the rearing and slaughter of animals
    20        which are used to produce their beef in that..."  And then
    21        "(a) some of them, especially chickens and pigs, spend
    22        their whole lives without access to open air or sunshine
    23        and without feeding as normal; (b) when waiting to be
    24        slaughtered they often struggle to escape; (c) cattle
    25        waiting to be slaughtered become frantic as they watch the
    26        animals before them in the killing line being garrotted,
    27        beaten, electrocuted and knifed; and (d), finally, they
    28        frequently have their throats cut while still fully
    29        conscious because of ineffective stunning methods" ---
    30
    31   MR. RAMPTON:  Yes.  I do not think there is much difference.
    32
    33   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  -- what troubles me about utter indifference
    34        to the welfare of animals.  The first question is, if what
    35        I have just suggested were the meaning of this part, is
    36        that within the scope of the meaning which is pleaded on
    37        behalf of the Plaintiffs by way of amendment, when it
    38        speaks of utter indifference to the welfare of animals in
    39        all those four respects which I have listed, A to D, and
    40        gross inhumanity in respects of the three, B to D.
    41
    42   MR. RAMPTON:  I would say so, because your Lordship's meaning is
    43        not littered with rhetorical adjectives -- that is comment
    44         -- "utterly" and "gross".  The word "culpably", I would
    45        respectfully submit, undoubtedly your Lordship could have
    46        used the word "condone"; it makes not much difference,
    47        because the word "culpably" encapsulates the state of mind
    48        which we sought to convey by the use of the word
    49        "indifferent".  We cannot be truly speaking indifferent,
    50        and you certainly cannot condone a bad state of affairs if 
    51        you do not know it is going on. 
    52 
    53   MR. JUSTICE BELL: What troubles me about that is that, at the
    54        moment it seems to me that one can be responsible for some
    55        cruel or inhumane practices, or allegedly cruel or inhumane
    56        practices, like the ones which are specified in the
    57        leaflet, without being utterly indifferent to animals'
    58        welfare.  It is not an exercise in mental gymnastics, and
    59        it might be particularly material in this kind of case;
    60        because it seems to me that you may perfectly well have

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