Day 187 - 13 Nov 95 - Page 37
1 returned, did he?
2
3 MR. RAMPTON: That may be so. The fact is, we have not seen
4 them; they were not disclosed when they should have been
5 disclosed at the time. Mr. Morris did not -----
6
7 MR. JUSTICE BELL: But I did not say they were to be disclosed.
8
9 MR. RAMPTON: No, my Lord. I asked for them. In the ordinary
10 way, if the document is discoverable, it is discoverable
11 without an order; and there we had -----
12
13 MR. JUSTICE BELL: But, surely, all I said was I was minded to
14 think they were discoverable, but before I went further on
15 that, I thought it only right that Miss Gabriel and/or
16 Channel 4 should be heard.
17
18 I mean, I am only saying this because it was clear from
19 what you said on a previous occasion that you appeared to
20 take exception to Mr. Morris returning them; and I am being
21 perfectly open, that unless it is suggested that he
22 returned them quickly without them being asked for in order
23 to avoid them being discovered, once he was asked for them
24 back, he had no good reason for holding on to them.
25
26 MR. RAMPTON: He did, with respect. What he should have done --
27 and what I would have done in his position -- is to have
28 said to Miss Gabriel: "A question has arisen over the
29 relevance of these transcripts in the proceedings, and the
30 judge has indicated they may be discoverable and the other
31 side has asked for them on discovery. I will not hand them
32 over at the moment, but this question does have to be
33 resolved by the court. The judge has indicated that if you
34 have anything to say to object to that, he will hear what
35 you have to say, you or Channel 4, or both." My Lord,
36 before any of that was allowed to take place, the
37 transcripts -- to put it neutrally -- disappeared out of
38 Mr. Morris' possession, leaving us with the only option,
39 which is to subpoena Jane Gabriel to bring the transcripts.
40
41 MR. JUSTICE BELL: What has happened about that?
42
43 MR. RAMPTON: What has happened about that is that we cannot
44 find Jane Gabriel's address. Plainly, Mr. Morris must have
45 it, or he must have a contact number for her, because he
46 has been able to return the transcripts to her.
47
48 I think it was on 30th October that Mrs. Brinley-Codd asked
49 Mr. Morris in court, after your Lordship had risen, whether
50 he would be good enough to approach Miss Gabriel, so that
51 she could give her address so we could subpoena her. The
52 next communication we had is the one of today, I think it
53 is, from Mr. Morris, saying: "Well, it is none of our
54 business. You make the best you can. We are going to call
55 Miss Tobin" -- which is more or less what he has just
56 said ---
57
58 MR. MORRIS: I wrote on 11th November.
59
60 MR. RAMPTON: -- which is just what he said to your Lordship just
