Day 127 - 23 May 95 - Page 75


     
     1   Q.   No, I want to know what you thought.
     2        A.  I personally thought it was a very well balanced
     3        document, but that was supported by senior management as
     4        well.  It is definitely a warts and all report, but we have
     5        never made out we are perfect for safety or anything else
     6        for that matter and we would not ------
     7
     8   Q.   When you agreed that they should do it, did you anticipate
     9        that it would be a warts and all report?
    10        A.  Yes, we did.  In fact, if they had not pointed out some
    11        of our weaknesses, it would not have been as much use to us
    12        as it turned out to be.
    13
    14   Q.   No.  Did you have any sense that in any area it was unfair,
    15        unkind or unjust to McDonald's?
    16        A.  No.  As I say, we felt it was very balanced and, of
    17        course, in every case it was comparing us against a
    18        document Successful Health and Safety Management ---
    19
    20   Q.   Yes, which it mentions at the beginning.
    21        A.  -- That is right, which had only be published at the
    22        end of 1991.
    23
    24   Q.   Was there any sense in which that document, the government
    25        document, represented a new approach to health and safety
    26        itself?
    27        A.  It was a completely new approach based on the
    28        principles of total quality management which had never
    29        before been applied to safety, and it is something that, as
    30        soon as the document came out, I just fell in love with.
    31        I thought it was an absolutely brilliant way of applying
    32        management to health and safety, and that is why, even
    33        before this document was put to us, I had already drafted
    34        out a plan for going forward based on the Successful Health
    35        and Safety Management.
    36
    37   Q.   I see, so can we picture, really, this idiotic metaphor,
    38        that these people, Andrew Foster and -- did he have a team
    39        of people with him?
    40        A.  No, he was on his own.
    41
    42   Q.   Andrew Foster had in one hand a pencil and a magnifying
    43        glass and in the other hand a copy of the government
    44        publication of 1991?
    45        A.  Well, he was in a strong position in that he worked
    46        with the people that wrote that document.  That document
    47        was written by the Accident Prevention Advisory Unit which
    48        was where Andrew foster worked, so he knew the document
    49        inside out.
    50 
    51   Q.   Conclusions, Mrs. Barnes, appear on 862 and go through as 
    52        conclusions to 5.10.  The only one I want to ask you 
    53        specifically about is on 862 in 5.3.  This, I am afraid, is
    54        a request for information. "However, there was no clear
    55        direction as to the means by which further improvements
    56        were to be achieved.  This may be due to the absence of a
    57        mission statement containing a commitment towards health
    58        and safety."  What is a mission statement in this context,
    59        Mrs. Barnes?
    60        A.  Well, I know, having spoken to Andrew, he was not

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