Day 016 - 22 Jul 94 - Page 50


     
     1        that apply in that particular country.
 
     2   Q.   Effectively, if something is not on the permitted list is
              it, effectively, banned or?
     3        A.  Well, you see, it may mean that it has not been
              considered at all.
     4
         Q.   Right, but it would not be allowed to be used?
     5
         MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I think what you are being asked is, can you
     6        use anything which is not on an approved list?
              A.  Oh, well, again I think I should explain.
     7
         Q.   I have difficulty -- can you just tell me very simply
     8        about additive?  What does it mean?  Something which is
              not a natural food stuff itself?
     9        A.  And something which is used in a relatively small
              amount.  I think I had a definition somewhere -- yes,
    10        page 52.
 
    11   Q.   Yes, thank you.  I had forgotten that.  The bit is "not
              normally used as a typical ingredient of food"; that is
    12        the crux of it?
              A.  Yes.  So, if I can try to answer your question,
    13        because what has happened in terms of the legislation
               -----
    14
         Q.   You can do it quite shortly?
    15        A.  OK.  Over the years we have moved from having a black
              list of substances that are not allowed to be used and
    16        anything that was not on that could be used, to one where
              we now only -- you can only use the ones that are already
    17        considered and are approved and, therefore, included in
              the appropriate regulations.
    18
         MR. RAMPTON:  My Lord, I do not know whether it helps, but I do
    19        have The Ministry of Agriculture Food and Fisheries
              booklet on additives.  I only intervene at this stage
    20        because your Lordship asked what additives were, and this
              tells you.  It has the complete list of permitted
    21        additives, all or mostly with E numbers.  It does not mean
              that when you put water in coffee you are adding an
    22        additive, or salt on your food.  They are particular
              substances.  I do not know whether your Lordship would
    23        like it?
 
    24   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I might read it for general education.
 
    25   MR. RAMPTON:  It is only general education.
              A.  The point I would want to make ----- 
    26 
         MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I will not look at it now.  I may take it 
    27        home to read.
              A.  The point I would want to make is if it is not on the
    28        approved list, it does not mean that it has been
              considered and banned; it might mean that it just has not
    29        been considered.
 
    30   MS. STEEL:   But, effectively, does that mean it cannot be
              used?

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