Day 208 - 24 Jan 96 - Page 43


     
     1
     2   Q.   When you are on with other Managers, do they say: "That is
     3        a bit out of order", or do they say: "That is exactly the
     4        way to do things"?
     5        A.  Most of the time they will leave it to your own
     6        personal judgment, and they would not comment on it at all.
     7
     8   Q.   And this was the attitude of the other Managers when you
     9        were a crew person, was it; they were happy for you to have
    10        less than your entitled break?
    11        A.  The attitude of a lot of the Floor Managers when I was
    12        a crew person was to get the breaks out the way as soon as
    13        possible and, if possible, to talk the individual into
    14        taking less of a break.  If you look at the Managers that
    15        are there, they are not there any more.
    16
    17   MS. STEEL:  I wanted to raise something, which is that when
    18        Mr. Morris asked a question just a minute ago and said that
    19        the witness did not know something this morning,
    20        Mr. Rampton said, "Yes, he did".  I have just looked back
    21        to what the witness actually said, and he said that if he
    22        worked an 11.00 to 4.00 shift, he was asked: "That is five
    23        hours.  How much break would you get for that?"  "Half an
    24        hour."  "Right.  That is what happened to you" --
    25        question. "I would probably not have taken half an hour,
    26        but that is my decision at the end of the day."
    27        I just point out that the clear implication of that is that
    28        the witness did think his entitlement was half an hour, but
    29        that he did not take the whole of that entitlement.
    30
    31   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I will say it now for a final time, so I can
    32        tell you what my provisional view is.  At the moment, if
    33        you had a young person of 18 years of age, when they are
    34        probably fit, active and healthy, who was entitled to a
    35        three-quarter of an hour break, if they decided that after
    36        half an hour they felt perfectly refreshed enough and,
    37        rather than take a further quarter of an hour's break, they
    38        would rather get back on the job and, as it happened, earn
    39        an extra quarter of an hour's money, I would not criticise
    40        the employee and I would not criticise the employer for
    41        letting him do so.
    42
    43        If, however, it turns out that the law obliges the employer
    44        to insist that the employee takes a three-quarters of an
    45        hour break, then it may be another matter, because you may
    46        be able to say that if McDonald's habitually breach this,
    47        they disregard provisions which Parliament in its wisdom
    48        has thought is in the interests of employees generally.
    49
    50        I do not really think you can usefully ask Mr. Cox any more 
    51        about it.  You can come back to the argument when you have 
    52        sorted out what the position is, whether it is just a 
    53        question of entitlement or what is obligatory.
    54
    55   MS. STEEL:  I was not particularly trying to continue the
    56        argument.  I was ------
    57
    58   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I know.  I am not making the point at you
    59        personally.  You have made your point about what the
    60        evidence actually was.  I am repeating it -- I am conscious

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