Day 289 - 29 Oct 96 - Page 27
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2 MS. STEEL: Yes.
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4 MR. JUSTICE BELL: And it was with that in mind that he advised
5 the ramps so that they get dragged up the ramp and then
6 fall into the -----
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8 MS. STEEL: Stun bath.
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10 MR. JUSTICE BELL: ---- the stun bath.
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12 MS. STEEL: Yes. If you want to check the Codes of Practice,
13 there is a reference to it on day 20, page 5, line 28 of
14 the transcript and it refers to tab H. I think that is
15 behind Dr. Gregory's statement, page 316. And the Codes of
16 Practice for the Welfare of Poultry at Slaughter, which is
17 produced by the Ministry of Agriculture, Fisheries and Food
18 states: "Faults leading to birds receiving pre-stun shocks
19 are unacceptable and must be corrected". And obviously
20 that is the Codes of Practice set up by MAFF, which can
21 hardly be said to have a bias towards the welfare of the
22 animals.
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24 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I do not know whether I accept that.
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26 MS. STEEL: Obviously they cannot be said to ignore the
27 commercial considerations. They are hardly an organisation
28 that is like an animal welfare body. They are about the
29 marketing and selling of -- the producing and marketing and
30 selling ----
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32 MR. JUSTICE BELL: MAFF has people from all sorts of
33 disciplines, each looking at problems ----
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35 MS. STEEL: Yes, I am not saying they do not have any concern
36 for animal welfare. I am saying that it is not like it is
37 a sort of animal welfare body that is just putting, you
38 know, the welfare point of view. The whole point is, it is
39 all about the business side.
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41 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I would have thought in that instance they
42 are putting entirely the welfare point of view. No doubt
43 it is the right point of view in relation to them. They
44 are not saying more than so and so, more than so many
45 percent, are they? They are just saying 'pre-stun shocks
46 are unacceptable'. No commercial consideration at all
47 there.
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49 MS. STEEL: That is basically because there are obviously
50 systems available where there do not have to be shocks.
51 But, I mean, in other areas, if there are not necessarily
52 methods available, you know, on another part of the process
53 which do not impinge on the welfare of the animals, then
54 they would say go ahead with it anyway. The point I am
55 making is that this is from the map, and they are not
56 taking any notice of that even. (Pause)
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58 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Is there really anything more to be said
59 about pre-stun shocks? I mean, you have made your point
60 in relation to that. Is there anything more you want to
