Day 246 - 09 May 96 - Page 37


     
     1        attended those meetings and I think they should have to
     2        disclose that.
     3
     4   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  What do you say about that, Mr. Rampton?
     5
     6   MR. RAMPTON:  My Lord, I would like to give it some thought.
     7        I cannot remember at the moment what the reason is why the
     8        people who were there have been blanked out.  I do not
     9        suppose there is anything sinister about it.  I do not
    10        remember Mr. Nicholson ever having his name on this list
    11        actually but we will look at that again.
    12
    13   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I would urge you to take a generous attitude
    14        towards giving the information because it is difficult to
    15        see how it can relate to privilege.  We can argue until the
    16        cows come home as to whether it is relevant or not but it
    17        is ----
    18
    19   MR. RAMPTON:  I agree with your Lordship.  It would be very
    20        unlikely that it was a question of privilege; it is much
    21        more likely it was a question of relevance and it may be
    22        that I shall maintain an objection on the ground of
    23        relevance because I am not obliged to make discovery in
    24        order to help the Defendants fish for a different case.
    25
    26   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I can understand why one should want to take
    27        that view so far as material within the memo is concerned,
    28        but I would ask you to think over whether it is really at
    29        the end of the day helpful to sustain that view with regard
    30        to who was actually present.
    31
    32   MR. RAMPTON:  That certainly is one approach and in an ordinary
    33        case, I would veer to your Lordship's approach and
    34        say: "Well, it may not be relevant but really does it
    35        matter?" In the circumstances of this particular case,
    36        rather different considerations apply and I have, from time
    37        to time, applied as strict a test of relevance as I
    38        have felt able to do so simply because I do not want the
    39        information to fall into the hands of the Defendants.
    40
    41        Whether looking back at the list of people there, I still
    42        feel that, I do not know, but Mr. Atkinson and I ----
    43
    44   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  One thing which occurs to me is if we know
    45        who was actually present by having the relevant boxes at
    46        the head of the documents completed, one knows straight
    47        away whether it is worth asking anyone who actually comes
    48        into the witness box whether can help about any of the
    49        topics which are raised on what has been disclosed.
    50        Otherwise, when someone like Mr. Nicholson comes into the 
    51        witness box, we have got to spend time where he has been 
    52        asked:  Was he present or was he not, when one can see at 
    53        an instant whether he was or whether he is not unless and
    54        until the good faith of whoever wrote in who was present is
    55        challenged.
    56
    57   MR. RAMPTON:  Yes.  I understand that practical advantage, but
    58        I am not without further thought willing to concede
    59        that----
    60

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