Day 073 - 13 Jan 95 - Page 22
1 countries. I think it is very unfair of Mr. Rampton to
2 make -----
3
4 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I think you should go on.
5
6 MR. MORRIS: I had certainly intended this would all be finished
7 by mid-afternoon today because Mr. Hopkins has come to
8 court about seven or eight times. I do not think he wants
9 to come back again.
10
11 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Carry on. I have tried to put to you a point
12 which concerns me because on one construction of what
13 Mr. Hopkins has in his statement it could be that any paper
14 products sourced from Canada must, therefore, be damaging
15 to the environment, because you cannot set foot in a
16 natural forest without damaging the environment. An
17 intermediate step would be that he has certain more
18 aggressive criticisms of how some forests in Canada have
19 been treated, but I do not know that they have anything
20 whatsoever to do with McDonald's; for instance, Vancouver
21 Island, and things like that.
22
23 MR. RAMPTON: My Lord, may I intervene here for this reason that
24 I am concerned: There is a whole section of Mr. Hopkins'
25 statement which deals with British Columbia and Vancouver
26 Island, and indeed with Oregon. It is quite clear on the
27 evidence of Mr. David Kouchoukos and the geographical
28 locations which he gave that McDonald's could not possibly
29 have any association with the deforestation of the old
30 forests of the Pacific North West. Their nearest pulping
31 plant is at Lewis, Idaho, which is 200 miles from Mount
32 Rainier (?) in the state of Washington, the greatest
33 range---
34
35 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Carry on. I have your point. I have your
36 point about plantation forests generally. Carry on with
37 any specific references you want to make. If there is
38 anything extra I should have from Mr. Hopkins in
39 elaboration of the specific references to McDonald's or the
40 more general statements, such as any paper products sourced
41 from Canada must therefore be damaging to the environment,
42 deal with that so that I can see how, if at all, that
43 comment is a criticism of McDonald's.
44
45 MR. MORRIS: Mr. Hopkins, I want to look at reference No. 12
46 which was produced by the Finnish Forests Industry
47 Federation, "The Green Change". I do not believe you have
48 a copy there?
49 A. I do have some of it but not all of it, I think.
50 I have chapter 5, "Biodiversity And Commercial Forests".
51
52 Q. Yes. In that case on page 18, chapter 5, there is a
53 section, "Green Values Come Forth". Do you want to quote
54 the relevant, any relevant part there?
55 A. Do you mind if I just swap the two copies because that
56 one is already marked up and this one is not; it makes it
57 easier. I think the most important things here, it is
58 slightly historical where it says: "In the early years of
59 plantation forestry, timber production was held to be the
60 dominating goal in the forestry". Then it deals with
