Day 089 - 15 Feb 95 - Page 64
1 A. Yes. We have a salmonella reduction programme within
2 the company, and we measure the incidence -- part of that
3 is that we measure the incidence of salmonella in the
4 intestines of live chickens coming into the poultry plant.
5 So we take an organ called cecum off the line from birds as
6 an indication of the carriage of salmonella organisms
7 within the intestine.
8
9 Q. We are not all anatomist. What is the cecum?
10 A. Cecum is a blind sac attached to the intestine rather
11 like the appendix in a human being.
12
13 Q. Is it a organ in which one expect to find an accumulation
14 of salmonella?
15 A. Yes, it would. It is regarded as the dustbin of the
16 intestine.
17
18 MR. MORRIS: When you said live chickens coming into the plant,
19 is that into the process plant?
20 A. Yes, correct. So that in the samples of cecum that we
21 take from the processing plant we find that 1 per cent of
22 them are contaminated with salmonella.
23
24 MR. RAMPTON: Does this mean, since cecum I take it is an organ
25 which is confined to a single bird, not a shared organ,
26 this means, in effect, does it, that one bird in every 100
27 that is examined, at least, is found to have salmonella?
28 A. That is correct.
29
30 Q. But the other 99 are not?
31 A. That is correct.
32
33 Q. Carry on from there, please, with, as it were, the
34 extrapolation given to Mr. North from the 1 per cent in the
35 live birds brought in to the 25 per cent found in the
36 product?
37 A. The 25 -----
38
39 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I think his wording was that the salmonella
40 burden in the end product was 25 per cent. Is that not
41 right?
42
43 MR. MORRIS: That is what it says in the statement.
44
45 MR. JUSTICE BELL: In his statement. I remember we discussed
46 what "salmonella burden" might be.
47
48 MR. RAMPTON: I am not presently concerned at all with what
49 Mr. North said. I want to know what Dr. Pattison told
50 Mr. North and what its explanation is, if it needs one.
51 A. The explanation simply means ----
52
53 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Just say what you said.
54
55 MR. RAMPTON: Yes, say what you told Mr. North.
56
57 MR. JUSTICE BELL: No one is expecting you to be word perfect,
58 but what did you say as best you can remember?
59 A. The 25 per cent per cent refers to an isolation rate of
60 samples of deboned meat at the end of our process. In
