Day 290 - 30 Oct 96 - Page 41
1 there was also a temptation to use one of the prongs as a
2 goad. He did say what that temptation was resisted whilst
3 he was there.
4
5 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Your reference to the Codes of Practice was
6 at the bottom of page 66.
7
8 MS. STEEL: Did I not read that out?
9
10 MR JUSTICE BELL: You did. You read it out. But do not go
11 through it now, because I am looking at it at the moment.
12
13 MS. STEEL: Right.
14
15 MR. JUSTICE BELL: What are you going to go on to next?
16
17 MS. STEEL: I am just trying to find -- I do not know,
18 actually.
19
20 MR. JUSTICE BELL: We will break off until 10.30 in the
21 morning.
22
23 One thing I need your help on at some stage is -- and it is
24 on the list of topics under animal welfare, which
25 Mr. Morris handed to me the Monday before last, and under
26 "General" it has got numbers and then "how to judge
27 suffering". Now, if pain is clearly caused, I do not see
28 any problem. If you are saying to me, generally speaking,
29 whatever you have to say about his evidence in detail,
30 Mr. Gregory is an expert in these matters and his evidence
31 should be generally well regarded and he says this should
32 not happen, and you go on to say, if he says that, the
33 inference is that it should not happen because it causes
34 the pig or the chicken or the steer a degree of suffering,
35 now, I understand that as well. But there may be areas in
36 the case where it is more difficult to judge whether there
37 is any degree and, if so, what degree of distress,
38 suffering (call it what you will) on the part of the
39 animal. It may not be right just to transpose human
40 experience to the animal. I am putting this in purely
41 neutral terms, because I am certainly not expressing a view
42 one way or another. If you think you have a key to whether
43 there will be a significant amount of suffering in the case
44 of a chicken or a pig, or a cow or steer, then I would
45 welcome your help on it. Many years ago, there was a
46 feeling in the farming community that if a chicken was fed
47 enough, drank enough and was kept at an equable
48 temperature, it was a happy hen. I think those days are
49 probably past. But I have got to turn my mind to what
50 elements, what the factors are that I can safely rely on
51 before I draw a conclusion that the animal has suffered to
52 any significant degree.
53
54 10.30 in the morning.
55
56 (The Court Adjourned)
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