Day 097 - 06 Mar 95 - Page 78


     
     1
     2   Q.   But you have not seen a specification with it on?
     3        A.  Absolutely.
     4
     5   Q.   An outsider like me might think it is a bit tough if there
     6        is something you have to abide by according to the audit
     7        form if it is not on the specification, because they have
     8        moved the goal post a bit in between.  But there we are.
     9
    10   MR. RAMPTON:  When they come and see and they look at everything
    11        maybe twice a year or whatever, have they seen you using
    12        goads?
    13        A.  We would not be making a secret of it when they come
    14        round.
    15
    16   Q.   Do you feel in the least bit secretive or ashamed about it?
    17        A.  No.
    18
    19   Q.   Something you have tried to hide?
    20        A.  No.
    21
    22   Q.   Does the OVS see you using goads?
    23        A.  Yes.
    24
    25   Q.   Have the MAFF people seen you using goads?
    26        A.  Yes.
    27
    28   Q.   Have the meat inspectors seen you using goads?
    29        A.  Yes.
    30
    31   Q.   But do you think it is likely that McKeys have seen you
    32        using goads?
    33        A.  I would think so.
    34
    35   Q.   Nobody has ever raised it with you?
    36        A.  I cannot recall the issue being raised, no.
    37
    38   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Would you be the chap to raise it with?
    39        A.  I usually accompany people when they are doing audits,
    40        sir, yes.
    41
    42   MR. RAMPTON:  So you would go around with them on the whole
    43        audit would you?
    44        A.  Yes.
    45
    46   Q.   Notice at the fifth point on slaughterhouses, Mr. Chambers,
    47        it says "Minimum holding of livestock overnight".  How
    48        often do you find it necessary to hold cattle overnight?
    49        A.  Every day.
    50 
    51   Q.   Every day.  In your view, from the animal welfare point of 
    52        view, does that have any importance whether they are held 
    53        hold overnight or not?
    54        A.  Provided they are held properly I do not see the
    55        welfare is compromised.
    56
    57   Q.   What are the signs that you would look for to tell whether,
    58        and I know you have an welfare or a specific person with
    59        animal welfare responsibility, but you personally, what are
    60        the signs that you would look for to detect distress in a

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