Day 113 - 03 Apr 95 - Page 54
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2 MR. JUSTICE BELL: If you have any more in relation to stunning
3 and sticking, ask it now and then we will have the break.
4
5 MR. MORRIS: I have lost my train of thought, so maybe it would
6 be useful to have the break.
7
8 (Short Adjournment)
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10 MR. MORRIS: You said that with the use of the captive bolt
11 pistol the period of time until the bleeding is effective,
12 is crucial. On what kind of number of occasions or
13 percentages do you feel that the welfare of the stunned
14 animal has been compromised in your experience, after the
15 stun?
16 A. First of all, I would say that one has to try to get
17 the knife in within 30 seconds of the animal falling out of
18 the stunning box, being hoist. That is my view. It is
19 difficult. You cannot do experiments in these
20 circumstances. I have known quite a number of animals
21 where it has been over a minute before the knife has been
22 plunged in.
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24 Q. You have seen that with your own eyes?
25 A. Yes, I have timed it.
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27 Q. From the animals that you have seen, however many that is,
28 being killed and stuck, what kind of prevalence is the over
29 30 seconds?
30 A. I would say it is 5 to 10 per cent that I have seen.
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32 Q. Maybe I should move on to pigs. There are a number of
33 outstanding bits and pieces on cattle but -----
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35 MR. JUSTICE BELL: What I suggest you do is go on to pigs now
36 and overnight make a list of matters which you have omitted
37 which you think are important enough to come back to in the
38 morning.
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40 MR. MORRIS: Yes. It is such a vast subject. We will go on to
41 pigs, but how would you summarise, you have just described
42 in quite a lot of detail the life of cattle destined for
43 slaughter for the modern beef industry, how would you
44 describe their lives if you had to summarise it?
45 A. I would say that it is quite needless and relentless
46 exploitation. I have always been very impressed by
47 Shakespeare, he uses in Henry VII to illustrate capacity
48 for treachery and betrayal. I think it betrays our dignity
49 and our wit and resource to look after animals and to look
50 after the environment.
51
52 Q. OK. If we move on to pigs, if you can do for pigs what you
53 did for cattle. First of all, are there similarities
54 between the modern pig production and the modern cattle
55 production?
56 A. Yes. Again I explain this question of the animal being
57 empty between pregnancies. That is the case with the sow.
58 You try to get her empty for the shortest period of time,
59 so the modern farmer (and this has been going on now for
60 some time) will try to get five farrowings in two years.
