Day 105 - 16 Mar 95 - Page 56
1 time.
2
3 MR. MORRIS: He did not comment on the documents; he only
4 commented on the visits.
5
6 MR. JUSTICE BELL: You see, what makes me anxious about this
7 (and you might bear it in mind as a topic to ask him about
8 before he goes into the witness box), we had spent an
9 enormous amount of time going over these TVCs and TCCs to
10 see whether they are adequate precautions and so on. It
11 may have been lack of wit on my part, but for the first
12 time I have actually heard a witness say they have nothing
13 to do with food safety when we are talking about food
14 safety and not food spoilage.
15
16 It is not a matter which any other witness has mentioned or
17 has been put to any other witness. We spoke about spoilage
18 bacteria, but I think it is the first suggestion we have
19 had. I have checked through Mr. North and there is nothing
20 about TVCs and TCCs there. It is occurring to me that, at
21 the end of the day, when I have heard all the evidence --
22 I have not even embarked on yours -- on this topic, TVCs
23 and TCCs may not matter a jot so far as food poisoning is
24 concerned.
25
26 MR. MORRIS: McDonald's seem to think they matter by raising
27 them in their defence about their -----
28
29 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Yes, but you picked up the gauntlet in a big
30 way so I was assuming they mattered from your point of view
31 as well.
32
33 MR. MORRIS: We are happy to pick up that gauntlet.
34
35 MR. JUSTICE BELL: It is entirely up to you what you ask your
36 witnesses about. I think it might be just as well before
37 you actually start asking Mr. North any questions in-chief
38 that you get it straight yourself what the position is on
39 them. As I have said before, it is not for me -- may I put
40 it that way -- if I was a barrister standing where you are
41 on your behalf, I would want to find out just what
42 Mr. North would say about something like that.
43
44 MR. MORRIS: If they are not relevant, all I can say is that the
45 meat industry is utterly reckless in making no attempt to
46 monitor pathological organisms, apart from recent E.coli.
47
48 MR. JUSTICE BELL: You say that, let us hear what Mr. North says
49 about it in due course. You see, at the moment he does not
50 say anything about monitoring and the need to monitor, or
51 anything of that kind. I have no idea what, if anything,
52 he will say about it when he gets into the witness box. It
53 would be a great irony if he comes into the witness box and
54 says exactly what Mr. Bennett has just been saying, I just
55 do not know.
56
57 Anyway, I have made the point. It is up to you whether you
58 take it up with him before he does go into the witness
59 box. Expert witnesses are not just weapons you deploy on
60 your own behalf. They are a source of information and
