Day 289 - 29 Oct 96 - Page 33


     
     1        width of the shackles and so on.  And just if you are doing
     2        something quickly, you are not taking as much care and it
     3        is far more likely that pain is going to be caused, and
     4        pain is what would cause them to flap around and therefore
     5        more likely to miss the water bath.
     6
     7   MR. JUSTICE BELL:   Yes.
     8
     9   MS. STEEL:   Yes.  On page 24 of the same day's transcript we
    10        went back to the point about the birds may appear to be
    11        effectively stunned but they could come round before they
    12        actually die, and that that was the reason why the Codes of
    13        Practice recommend that unless there is a cardiac arrest at
    14        stunning then both carotid arteries should be cut in order
    15        to produce a humane kill.  Dr. Gregory agreed that neither
    16        of those methods were being used in February when he made
    17        his first visit and that despite the recommendations he
    18        made after his visit in February neither of those methods
    19        was being used by the time of his second visit.  I think,
    20        yes, he says that they finally got a ventral neck cutter,
    21        but only about two or three months before he gave
    22        evidence.
    23
    24        I went through his statement on page 7, the last but one
    25        paragraph, where he says, "If, on the other hand, the
    26        vessels at the back of the neck are severed, blood can be
    27        continuously supplied to the brain during the early part of
    28        the bleeding period."  I asked him, "What would the effect
    29        be of that?" and he said, "It would sustain brain functions
    30        such that if the effectiveness of the stun wore off the
    31        bird could regain consciousness."  I went on to ask him,
    32         "Given that he had informed the company in February that
    33        they could be criticised for masking recovery of
    34        consciousness by severing the spinal cord did it concern
    35        him that in April when he went back they were still using
    36        the same technique and that this would have masked recovery
    37        of conscious of 83 percent of the birds" and he said,
    38        "I expected to see something different".
    39
    40   MR JUSTICE BELL:   Do you have that reference?
    41
    42   MS. STEEL:   Yes, it is day 20, page 24, line 28.  I then said,
    43        "So it concerned you?" and he said, "It surprised me, yes,
    44        and concerned me."  He said, on the following page that he
    45        was not aware of any reason why Sun Valley could not have
    46        reduced the depth of the cut into the neck so that if
    47        consciousness was regained it would not be masked.
    48
    49        This is a bit confusing actually, because the 0.7 percent
    50        of birds which showed a reflex response and the reference 
    51        to the fact that they had failed to make contact with the 
    52        water bath stunner, which would indicate that they had not 
    53        been stunned, there were also figures in his statement on
    54        the same page in the second paragraph that one percent of
    55        birds missed the water bath stunner and hence were not
    56        stunned, and the reference to that, which was actually
    57        given in evidence, was day 20, page 30, line 18.
    58
    59   MR. JUSTICE BELL:   Just pause a moment.  (Pause) Well, I think
    60        what happened was that it was one bird showed a reflex

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