Day 097 - 06 Mar 95 - Page 42


     
     1   MR. RAMPTON:  All right.  I will ask the witness.
     2        (To the witness):  Does McKey specification, Mr. Chambers,
     3        allow the use of bull meat?
     4        A.  No.
     5
     6   Q.   How do you ensure it does not get into the meat which you
     7        send to McKey?
     8        A.  Because, being a production line, we obviously produce
     9        certain types or debone certain types of meat at certain
    10        times.  We would not put a bull forequarter down with a
    11        load of cow forequarters, for instance.
    12
    13   Q.   This may seem to you a blindingly obvious and rather stupid
    14        question, how can you tell the difference between, for
    15        example, bull forequarter -- do not laugh, please, I have
    16        to ask this question -- and a heifer forequarter?
    17        A.  Generally speaking, it would be larger but the
    18        carcasses are selected for boning at the chilling stage
    19        before that, and at that stage they have actually got a
    20        label on saying what they are which has come from the
    21        slaughter hall, so .....
    22
    23   Q.   What about old, wet screw cows or canner quality cows; does
    24        McKeys allow you to send them that sort of meat?
    25        A.  No.
    26
    27   Q.   How do you ensure that it does not happen?
    28        A.  It is pretty self-governing really because the
    29        hindquarters of the sides largely go for export and, you
    30        know, nobody really requires that type of meat anyway, so
    31        it is self-governing.  We do not have forequarters with
    32        those cows if we do not have hindquarters.
    33
    34   MS. STEEL:  Can I just say something which is that we actually
    35        asked that Mr. Rampton did not ask leading questions.  He
    36        could quite easily have said to the witness:  "What type of
    37        meat will McKeys accept and what will they not accept?" He
    38        has gone ahead and asked the leading questions
    39        nonetheless.  I think that it should not carry on.
    40        Mr. Rampton knows what our matters in issue, and he should
    41        not be asking leading questions.
    42
    43   MR. RAMPTON:  It is not a leading question, I do not believe, my
    44        Lord, to ask whether McKeys allows the use of this, that or
    45        the other kind of meat.
    46
    47   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I would not have thought it was leading
    48        question which offends if you point witnesses at a
    49        particular topic or article and ask whether they take that
    50        or not.  There are various definitions of leading 
    51        questions, one of which at one time was which allowed of 
    52        the question "yes" or "no", but that is totally 
    53        impracticable.  As far as I am concerned, a leading
    54        question is one which points the witness at a particular
    55        answer.  To ask whether someone accepts this, that or the
    56        other does not point them at the answer.
    57
    58   MS. STEEL:  It does when it is said in a way that implies that
    59        there is something -- it would have been a simple matter
    60        just to ask what meat will they accept.

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