Day 302 - 18 Nov 96 - Page 32


     
     1        would contain elements of all these major issues, but, to
     2        be honest, I think that our case virtually supersedes the
     3        actual testimony because the documentation is so strong on
     4        the employment issue that it deals with all the points
     5        relevant to the fact sheet.  Even before you go into the
     6        detail of local stores, that comes out of the testimony.
     7        Although, of course, the local testimony is very important
     8        because it backs up everything we have been saying, in any
     9        event.
    10
    11        I mean, although I say that, I do say that I would have
    12        analysed the testimony from all the local stores if I had
    13        had the time and the ability to do so, which I just have
    14        not had, for whatever reason.
    15
    16   MR. JUSTICE BELL:   Well, anyway, you want me to pick up any
    17        point I see there one way or the other?
    18
    19   MR. MORRIS:   Yes, please.
    20
    21        I think that deals with health and safety.  On the union
    22        side, before I go on to Mr. Pearson -- maybe I will go on
    23        to Mr. Pearson now, actually.  Unfortunately, I am going to
    24        have to go through the transcript.  I will try and do
    25        it....  Can I ask if you might be able to actually read
    26        Mr. Pearson's evidence.
    27
    28   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Yes, I propose to read his, and, I regret to
    29        say, I have forgotten the name of the other -----
    30
    31   MR. RAMPTON:   Turnbull, my Lord.
    32
    33   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Mr. Turnbull, yes.  Anyway, you would like me
    34        to read both, would you?
    35
    36   MR. MORRIS:   Yes, please, yes.  In that case, I will try and
    37        whip through it quickly, but it is pretty important.
    38        Obviously, we would say he is thoroughly versed in the
    39        issue as an expert from his present position as a research
    40        worker for industrial relation services.  He was in the
    41        Transport and General Workers Union as an official,
    42        I think, for about eleven years, and then he had worked for
    43        an organisation called the Pay Equity Project which was
    44        concerned with low pay and unequal pay, and he worked for
    45        the low pay unit.  And he was a member of various wages
    46        councils relevant to this issue as an official.  He was
    47        concerned with hotel and catering, an official in the
    48        Transport and General Workers Union.  He had also worked
    49        for a migrant advisory group, I can't remember the name of
    50        it now, which dealt with the special concerns of ethnic
    51        minority and migrant workers.
    52
    53        There was a point where Mr. Rampton said that the witness
    54        was relying on a substantial quantity of hearsay in some
    55        parts of his statement and then he said, "I do not object
    56        to that because an expert is entitled to form a view on
    57        what he has been told."  And we would say that is very
    58        true.  Sorry, that was on day 180, page 4, line 39.
    59
    60   MR. RAMPTON:   Yes, but my Lord that does not mean to say that

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