Day 166 - 28 Sep 95 - Page 57
1 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40 or even 45 hours in a week. That
2 has been a complete mystery to me throughout this case.
3
4 MS. STEEL: I do not think we have actually said that.
5
6 MR. MORRIS: What we have said ------
7
8 MR. RAMPTON: What is the cross-examination about that, I ask,
9 if there is nothing wrong with it?
10
11 MR. MORRIS: What we have said, for Mr. Rampton's benefit in
12 case he missed it, is that we consider the non-payment of
13 overtime to be illegal, but in any case immoral for working
14 over 39 hours. Therefore, the fact that a quarter of all
15 their full-time staff are working over 39 hours and, in
16 fact, the majority of the rest of their full-time staff, if
17 you include their breaks which they do not get paid for,
18 are also probably working over 39 hours, then the reality
19 is it is something that is a standard practice in the
20 Company. That is our position, if it helps.
21
22 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I understand that, what I wonder is how that
23 is being developed with this witness.
24
25 MR. MORRIS: No, I understand.
26
27 MR. JUSTICE BELL: The other thing do not forget what I said
28 some time ago now, that although it is true that on the
29 occasion when I was paid hourly if one worked more than the
30 basic hourly week which, I have to say, was considerably
31 more than 39 hours, you got paid time and a half or even
32 double time in some circumstances. That is an awful long
33 time ago and well over 30 years, in fact. I am not
34 prepared to just assume that it is common practice.
35
36 Do you remember, I gave you the illustration that I know
37 because, I do not mind saying this, it is what happens to
38 one of my children if he works more than whatever the
39 normal hours are for a week, he does not get paid extra
40 money for it, but he gets it in additional leave. But it
41 is only these little key holes on what is happening which
42 are my experience.
43
44 So, if you are going at the end of the day to say that it
45 is general practice, if you are on an hourly rate as
46 opposed to, perhaps, a salary or something like that, to
47 get paid time and a half or double time once you work over
48 the basic week's hours, I want you to call some evidence as
49 to that because -----
50
51 MS. STEEL: There was the Wages Council Order.
52
53 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Then produce it to me.
54
55 MS. STEEL: We had it with Mr. Nicholson.
56
57 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Right. But I do not know what the situation
58 is nowadays. It may vary from industry to industry. I am
59 not arguing that you are wrong about it. I am just saying
60 I will require some support, not just a declaration in the
