Day 099 - 08 Mar 95 - Page 76


     
     1        A.  It is the total count.
     2
     3   Q.   Colony count.
     4        A.  Even if salmonella is present in the meat, we know
     5        definitely that it will be present in some of the chicken
     6        we receive into our restaurant, but we have to fully cook
     7        that product. That is the only sure way of guaranteeing
     8        that the product is totally safe.  So, these are
     9        guidelines.  These are what you would expect to find in the
    10        industry in meat.  So you would not really expect to find
    11        them saying here any salmonella.  If you took five samples
    12        you would not expect to find any salmonella.  That is the
    13        industry standard.  That is what you would expect.  This is
    14        not law.  This is not what you would have to meet to send
    15        out a product.  It is a standard.
    16
    17   MR. MORRIS:  But in any event, according to Mr. Walker and what
    18        you have just said as well, the total viable count is not a
    19        positive release issue.  In other words, if it is over the
    20        total viable count what happens is there some contact with
    21        the supplier who supplied McKey's to say that was
    22        unacceptable, that is the sanction, yes?
    23        A.  That is on their tests on the raw material, but not on
    24        their tests on our finished product.
    25
    26   Q.   Mr. Walker said that basically once it has been made into
    27        patties the only positive release sanction is for E.coli,
    28        but in your explanation you are not concerned about the
    29        E.coli as a separate specific finding?
    30        A.  The E.coli was not written into the original meat
    31        specification; it is something that has happened since
    32        then.  In discussion between McDonald's and McKey's we have
    33        asked for that additional check to be put in.
    34
    35   Q.   So the E.coli is on positive release results?
    36        A.  Yes, that is correct.
    37
    38   Q.   That is the only positive release sanction from a finished
    39        product according to Mr. Walker?
    40        A.  As positive release goes, yes, that is true.
    41
    42   Q.   All other products in his evidence he said will go through,
    43        apart from if it is positive for E.coli, that is how you
    44        understand it?
    45        A.  We would be informed if the total count exceeded our
    46        specification because those results would come off prior to
    47        the E.coli results.  So, we would be made aware that the
    48        product they had exceeded our specification.  This is just
    49        a McDonald's specification.  I think we are getting a bit
    50        cloudy.  It is something we asked our product to be. 
    51 
    52   Q.   You would be informed about it. 
    53        A.  We ask a number of things of our products. He would
    54        inform us to say, "Look, we have this product, it is a
    55        little bit outside your specification." If that were the
    56        case then a decision would be taken whether to let it go or
    57        not.  Positive release, they would not.  If they found the
    58        E.coli 0157 in their product, they would not even bother
    59        picking up the phone straightaway.  The stuff would be
    60        disposed of.

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