Day 306 - 26 Nov 96 - Page 16


     
     1        fact he did actually note me down on 20th September as
     2        well.  That is that.
     3
     4        The other thing is, when I talked about the layers of
     5        getting further and further away from primary evidence in
     6        the development of the statements that the witness had
     7        done, also I should have added that the notes of course
     8        were only...  We do not believe they are very good evidence
     9        and contain lots of unreliable matters, including
    10        impressions, things gleaned from the meetings, hearsay
    11        based upon what someone else said and what someone else
    12        said, and all that kind of matter.  So that only compounds
    13        at each stage how unreliable the process is.
    14
    15        When we come to Alan Clare he attended over 18 meetings and
    16        he only noted me down at one meeting, which was the 1st
    17        March.  Yes, that was the meeting Roy Pocklington, or
    18        Anthony Pocklington, had said that there were no essential
    19        people at, and that may be one reason why nothing got
    20        decided.  So I cannot really see how Alan Clare could have
    21        any kind of impression of me, certainly not any balanced
    22        recollection of me, at the time, and certainly not six
    23        years later.  But he certainly might have had a
    24        construction about me, because before he met me...
    25
    26        If we go to his transcript, day 265, page 26, line 17,
    27        Mr. Rampton questioned him, and I think he read out
    28        something from either his notes or the report or the
    29        statement, "I was asked to try to establish who were the
    30        core members of the group and who were the authors and
    31        distributors of this leaflet."  So his task was, 'find the
    32        core members and those who are authors and distributors of
    33        this leaflet and here are some photographs to help you on
    34        your way'.  Who is to say there were any core members of
    35        the group?   In fact, who is to say there were any members
    36        at all?   But here we have, in his young, inexperienced
    37        mind, he has been set off to establish something which in
    38        any case there may have been no core; in fact, there was
    39        not a core, and there were no members, and the five or six,
    40        whatever it is, photographs he had been shown did not
    41        necessarily correspond to who was actively attending
    42        meetings.
    43
    44        I certainly was not, but he was shown a photograph of me.
    45        In fact I had only been to one meeting in five months
    46        before 1st March, and that was a meeting which was the
    47        future of the group meeting, which my recollection was that
    48        I had been asked to come especially even though I was not
    49        active in the group.
    50 
    51        He says on page 26, line 27 that also a leaflet was 
    52        described to me, he does not say how or what. 
    53
    54        I am finding it hard to concentrate
    55
    56   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Can you keep your voices down?  It is a bit
    57        distracting.
    58
    59   MR. RAMPTON:   I am sorry, my Lord.  I am so sorry, we are
    60        having a slight altercation.

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