Day 196 - 06 Dec 95 - Page 24


     
     1        store.  I did not actually see it as, oh, I am doing
     2        something illegal.
     3
     4   Q.   Was there anything wrong with doing it?
     5        A.  The only thing -----
     6
     7   Q.   If the customers did not like it they could complain or not
     8        come back?
     9        A.  Where it is wrong I suppose ----
    10
    11   Q.   It might have been wrong in that ----
    12        A.  It is morally wrong.
    13
    14   Q.   --- if someone right at the top had discovered it they
    15        might have been horrified, but there was nothing wrong in
    16        the sense of any illegality or breaking some promise of
    17        McDonald's to its customer, was there?
    18        A.  Where we were actually doing something wrong was the
    19        fact that we were breaking the laid down written
    20        procedures ----
    21
    22   Q.   Yes, I understand that.
    23        A.  --- of the Company, as opposed to a legal procedure
    24        where this is the portion you should have.  Everything has
    25        a size, a portion amount, it is all very strongly
    26        documented as to how much ketchup should go on, how much
    27        onion, what constitutes a good milk shake.  By doing that
    28        we were trying to save money for the store as opposed to
    29        improve the quality of the product.
    30
    31   MR. MORRIS:  You said you felt it was morally wrong.  Were you
    32        happy to do these kinds of things?
    33
    34   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Did you say it was morally wrong?
    35        A.  When you asked me just now, I suppose it was morally
    36        wrong.
    37
    38   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Did you say that?
    39        A.  Did I say that?
    40
    41   MS. STEEL:  I thought I heard him say it but you were talking at
    42        the same time.
    43
    44   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Perhaps that is why I missed it.  I can
    45        understand it may be morally wrong if you are an employer
    46        who has set procedures and you decide to break them for
    47        other reasons, but did you see it as morally wrong for any
    48        other reason?
    49        A.  At the time I did not see anything wrong with doing
    50        it.  I saw it as a way of achieving an aim I had actually 
    51        been set and it very quickly became part of the normal 
    52        working practices. 
    53
    54   MR. MORRIS:  McDonald's have said that the customer is
    55        paramount, the quality of the service to the customer.  Do
    56        you have any comment on that in the light of watering down
    57        products to increase profit?
    58        A.  As I said previously I felt ----
    59
    60   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  That is not relevant to anything in this

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