Day 286 - 24 Oct 96 - Page 19
1 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Well, maybe, but if you fence any part of it
2 or run cattle on any part of it are you displacing the
3 people by doing that?
4
5 MR. MORRIS: I would say you were, because it would take on the
6 character of, even though it would not necessarily be a
7 dominating invasion, it is an invasive type of involvement
8 on that land because of the character of the cattle
9 ranching industry. But what has actually happened, I think
10 in reality what has happened is that it has not been that
11 there are a few cattle ranchers on otherwise, you know,
12 natural forest and vegetation belonging to indigenous
13 peoples; what has actually happened is that it is the
14 opposite. There is complete colonisation where the
15 indigenous peoples have been forced into tiny reserves
16 where they are unable to maintain their culture or their
17 livelihood. So in some ways it may be a kind of academic
18 argument about whether.... Do you see what I mean?
19
20 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Yes, I understand. Yes, what were you going
21 on to next, then?
22
23 MR. MORRIS: I am just having a quick look through notes about
24 Fiona Watson's evidence, just in case Mr. Rampton.... She
25 is clearly an expert on indigenous peoples and their
26 culture and what is undermining such culture. She is
27 working for Survival International in that capacity.
28 Mr. Rampton may want to bring up the fact that the body
29 that is entrusted with monitoring the dispossession and
30 damage to indigenous cultures in Mato Grosso do Sul, which
31 we provide evidence of, which he says in his submissions
32 anyway, I believe is admissible hearsay even without a
33 witness, if it is an authorised authoritative body doing
34 that kind of research.
35
36 But, in any event, as we have heard from Fiona Watson, that
37 is very authoritative information, but there seems to have
38 been one misprint in the entire document which he could
39 identify with a number clearly out of place in one place.
40 And if he wants to therefore discredit the entire
41 organisation, which I think Fiona Watson recognises is the
42 most authoritative body working on this subject in Brazil,
43 I think that would be absurd to the point of irrelevance.
44
45 Obviously one misprint in a document does not invalidate
46 the whole document and the whole picture is what we are
47 concerned with. If we had just been concerned with that
48 one particular place, we understand if she was relying on
49 information then that might be open to question, but we are
50 talking about a whole process over a whole region with a
51 whole body of information provided by the most
52 authoritative body charged with that responsibility.
53
54 Now, I just want to have a quick look if I have got any
55 more on Brazil, apart from ----
56
57 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Just sit down. Apart from?
58
59 MR. MORRIS: Apart from the soya issue, which I might bring up
60 as a specific point. (Pause) I think I have largely
