Day 060 - 02 Dec 94 - Page 69


     
     1        remember that?
     2        A.  I do.
     3
     4   Q.   So that would be a mistake, would it not, really, that
     5        sentence -- maybe that was before you got a copy of that
     6        report or you did not get a copy of the report; that was
     7        before the report.  So, in the light of that report, would
     8        you re-evaluate that sentence?
     9        A.  I think if you are talking piece for piece, like one
    10        sheet of wrap versus one polystyrene box, the point you are
    11        making is good.  But if you are talking total volume, the
    12        point you are making is not good.
    13
    14   Q.   I do not understand.  Surely the volume is an additional
    15        consideration of the problems caused by foam packaging?
    16        A.  No.  You are talking about specifically about energy
    17        here and resource efficient.  The energy it takes to make a
    18        large volume of foam is pretty much the same energy as it
    19        would take to make half of that volume.  So it is not
    20        something you can relate entirely piece for piece to.
    21        I think in the study you showed me earlier they were
    22        comparing wraps with foam, yes.
    23
    24   Q.   Do you not think that is what the customer would be doing?
    25        When you are advocating foam packaging as opposed to paper
    26        packaging, they are going to think you are comparing your
    27        choice to change, as you have said earlier on, from paper
    28        to polystyrene, i.e. one item to another item?  You are
    29        saying to the customer that foam packaging is more energy
    30        and resource efficient to produce, so you are misleading
    31        the customer then?
    32        A.  No, I think overall that is correct.  It is not
    33        correct ----
    34
    35   Q.   That is not what you said before and it is not what
    36        McDonald's and the Environmental Defence Fund found which I
    37        do not want to go back to.
    38        A.  I know you do not.  My point is you are not comparing
    39        like with like.  You cannot compare a wrap with a foam
    40        package.
    41
    42   Q.   Surely that is what you are doing here in your leaflet,
    43        which, presumably, you produce millions of ---
    44        A.  I think that is.
    45
    46   Q.   -- to customers?
    47        A.  I think that is a generic statement there.
    48
    49   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  I know you are trying to save time which is
    50        laudable, but if there is something in the other report 
    51        which you say contradicts this, I think you should put it 
    52        to Mr. Oakley.  Apart from anything else, I can see what 
    53        the difference is.  Do you have the reference?
    54
    55   MR. MORRIS:  It was the one we looked at this morning.  It
    56        certainly was tab 5 in volume IV.  It is the EDF Report.
    57
    58   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  Page 223, the final report of McDonald's Task
    59        Force, pink IV, tab 5, page 233.
    60

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