Day 283 - 21 Oct 96 - Page 38
1 save that if things are matters that are well known, as it
2 were, the world round, they can be relied upon as well.
3 That is no doubt a rather sloppy -----
4
5 MR. RAMPTON: I only just say, it may help, I think probably on
6 the law the correct order is stated, or sufficiently
7 referred to.
8
9 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Yes, sufficiently referred to. But I have
10 taken the opportunity as early as this to mention it
11 because it is not a matter which was necessarily easy to
12 take hold of in the context of this case. If, when you
13 come to it, you say bad pay is a statement of fact, that
14 does not trouble me; we can just look and see whether the
15 pay is bad or low or repressed, or whatever. If it is a
16 matter of comment and there is nothing in the leaflet to
17 show what the basis for that comment is, at the moment it
18 seems to me it can only be defended by a justification of
19 it as a statement of fact, not defended as fair comment.
20
21 If you say bad conditions of employment is a comment rather
22 than a statement of fact, then it can be justified by
23 matters referred to -- sorry, I should not have used the
24 word 'justified', it can be defended as being fair comment
25 bearing in mind the matters of fact which are established,
26 which might include low pay or noisy, smelly environment or
27 long hours, and so on, provided they are sufficiently
28 referred to in the leaflet. But it cannot be defended as
29 fair comment by looking at health and safety because that
30 is nowhere referred to in the leaflet. If you say bad
31 conditions are a statement of fact and a general charge,
32 then you can refer to matters like health and safety which
33 are not referred to in the leaflet. I am not going to
34 invite any reaction from Mr. Rampton to that. I say it in
35 case you do get a copy of the transcript and you do go off
36 and get some legal advice, someone may help you as to it.
37 When you actually come to employment, I will raise it
38 again.
39
40 MR. MORRIS: Right.
41
42 MR. JUSTICE BELL: And where you go through each topic,
43 economic, imperialism, destruction of the rainforest,
44 nutrition, advertising, rearing and slaughter, food
45 poisoning and employment -- I have taken them in that order
46 because I think that is the order they crop up in the
47 leaflet -- I will ask you, do you accept that we are
48 dealing with statements of fact here, where justification
49 is the primary defence or do you say some of it is
50 comment? If you do say it is comment, and it is fair
51 comment, what are the facts to which there is sufficient
52 reference in the leaflet which you say are proved and which
53 make the comment fair? But there we are, do not worry
54 about it. I would like you to go back to your previous
55 thing rather than venture into a discussion here.
56
57 MR. MORRIS: What makes me -----
58
59 MR. JUSTICE BELL: It is a matter I do not necessarily find
60 easy, which is why I have raised it with you.
