Day 079 - 27 Jan 95 - Page 68
1 MR. JUSTICE BELL: If you are suggesting that Mr. Walker is
2 lying, you must put to him the respect in which he is
3 lying. There is no getting round it because otherwise if
4 you come in your final submissions to say to me: "We
5 suggest that Mr. Walker was lying" and I say: "In what
6 respect?", and you tell me a respect, then I say: "Look,
7 I gave you the opportunity to put that to him and you did
8 not".
9
10 MS. STEEL: I think we would have to go through this. Dave
11 actually did say: "I do not believe McKey's takes
12 thousands of samples". We have been through how many
13 samples were being taken, so it has been put basically.
14
15 MR. JUSTICE BELL: But, you see, people can be mistaken,
16 genuinely mistaken.
17
18 MR. MORRIS: Yes. Could it be that you are mistaken as to the
19 volume of samples of finished products -- sorry, I have
20 lost my train of thought.
21
22 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Can I say this to you? If, on reflection,
23 you think it was a symptom of Friday afternoon that you
24 said what you did, and what you are really saying is that
25 one way or another that is not what happens, I think you
26 should just say, if it be so: "I am sorry I accused you of
27 lying; all I meant to suggest was that in various respects
28 what you have said happened does not" for whatever reason.
29 There is no shame in doing that. Enough barristers say
30 things which they later regret and, therefore, I have
31 sympathy for litigants in person who might do exactly the
32 same thing. But one needs to know while Mr. Walker is in
33 the witness box whether it is actually an allegation of
34 lying or it is an allegation: "Things do not always happen
35 the way you have said" for whatever reason.
36
37 MR. MORRIS: Do you feel that there is any way that you could be
38 mistaken about the volume of the testing of finished
39 samples that is done at McKey's?
40 A. No.
41
42 Q. That is both for general bacteriological testing and E.coli
43 testing?
44 A. Yes, and cooking.
45
46 Q. And?
47 A. And cooking.
48
49 Q. Shall we continue with the cross-examination?
50
51 THE WITNESS: No. I would like an apology, my Lord.
52
53 MR. JUSTICE BELL: No, you cannot demand an apology. I cannot
54 demand an apology. All I can ask you again, if you are
55 actually -----
56
57 MR. MORRIS: I have not directly -----
58
59 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I think you have, in fact.
60
