Day 073 - 13 Jan 95 - Page 18


     
     1        and tended forest cannot contain all the biological
     2        qualities and variations that are to be found in the
     3        natural forest, or it is damaging to the environment in a
     4        more extensive way.  I am not asking you for an answer on
     5        that now because you could say the moment a man sets foot
     6        in a natural forest he will damage the environment, even if
     7        it is because he treads on a beetle.  Do you understand the
     8        point I am trying to make?
     9        A.  Yes.
    10
    11   MR. RAMPTON:  My Lord, might I intervene at this stage?  I have
    12        sat patiently.  I said something earlier which was intended
    13        to be helpful.  One knows one has a heavy schedule ahead in
    14        this case.  One knows that time saved in court may usefully
    15        be spent in preparing for what might be more difficult and
    16        complex issues than this one.
    17
    18        May I be quite plain -- I may be wrong; your Lordship will
    19        tell me if I am -- but, as I see it, the issues so far as
    20        Mr. Hopkins, or this area of the case, is concerned, are
    21        these:  First, the amount of trees consumed by McDonald's
    22        annually, indirectly of course but eventually by
    23        McDonald's, for the purpose of packaging; secondly, the
    24        geographical location of the forests from which those trees
    25        are taken and, as a consequence of that, the nature of
    26        those forests in those precise geographical locations; are
    27        they old growth forests such as may be found in Oregon or
    28        British Columbia?  Are they, on the contrary, plantation
    29        forests such as nowadays may be found, for example, in
    30        Scotland?
    31
    32        Then, following finally from that, as a consequence of all
    33        of that, what, truly speaking, is the environmental damage
    34        which may be attributed to McDonald's' use of paper?
    35
    36        My Lord, I do resist very strongly this court being used
    37        and my clients' money and your Lordship's time as the forum
    38        for what I call a collateral dispute or argument,
    39        interesting though it may be, between people like
    40        Mr. Hopkins on the one hand and people like Mr. Mallinson
    41        on the other.
    42
    43   MR. MORRIS:  I am afraid Mr. Mallinson gave a great deal of
    44        evidence on comparisons between plantation forests and
    45        natural forests and problems, or not problems, that the
    46        industry has in trying to maintain diversity and
    47        biodiversity and changing practices.  A lot of that is
    48        general expert opinion about the general problems you have
    49        with plantation forestry.
    50 
    51        If the Plaintiffs are willing to accept -- I believe 
    52        Mr. Mallinson indicated he was willing to accept -- that 
    53        plantations forests are ecologically bound to be less
    54        diverse ----
    55
    56   MR. RAMPTON:  In a sense, yes, of course, that is right.  My
    57        Lord, again, I do not interrupt through any lack of
    58        courtesy, but really that is not the question in this
    59        case.  The only way in which McDonald's could not have an
    60        impact on trees, whether great or small, is to stop using

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