Day 147 - 04 Jul 95 - Page 26
1 MR. MORRIS: Not at all. I am responding to Mr. Rampton's
2 statements he made yesterday and he made again today,
3 attacking the Defendants' integrity. If he wants to do
4 that, then we have a right to explain our understanding of
5 the situation. The problem seems to be for McDonald's,
6 they should encourage their witnesses not to make
7 admissions helpful to the Defendants, and then -----
8
9 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I only really want an argument which will
10 help me to the right conclusion about this, quite frankly.
11 We have not got past the question of transcripts and
12 CaseView. What I do want you to do is respond to what
13 Mr. Rampton has said, because if you are talking about
14 fairness, one of the things I have to ask myself -- you are
15 saying how unfair it would be that you will not have a
16 transcript so that you can check it, and you will not have
17 a verbatim account of all the evidence to remind you of it
18 when you come to final speeches. You could have all that
19 if you accepted McDonald's offer, as I interpret it to be,
20 to provide you with a transcript, provided you undertake
21 not to show it to anyone else. You would then have a
22 transcript, so that you could look back at the evidence and
23 think about the cross-examination; you would have a
24 transcript to help you with your final speeches.
25
26 All McDonald's are saying is: "If you want us to pay for
27 it, you must promise not to show it to someone else." You
28 can have it there in your hand, as far as I am aware, when
29 you talk to your McKenzie Friend. I have, from time to
30 time, suggested that when you take advice you show any
31 McKenzie Friend what I have said, because on occasions when
32 there has been a matter of law I have done my best to put
33 the arguments on both sides, so you could show it to the
34 McKenzie Friend who might then be able to advise you. For
35 all I know, in the future, Mr. Rampton would say: "Yes, we
36 do not mind you showing that to a McKenzie Friend, what the
37 judge has said."
38
39 MS. STEEL: This trial is in the public arena. This is
40 rapidly -- well, it has turned into a matter of
41 censorship. There is no reason why people should not be
42 able to find out what is going on in these proceedings.
43 Copyright applies to making copies to distribute to people,
44 hand to other people. If people ask us what has gone on in
45 court, there is absolutely no reason why we should not be
46 able to tell them an accurate account of what was said.
47
48 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Yes. I do not think anyone is disputing
49 that.
50
51 MS. STEEL: Then what is the problem? We have already said we
52 are not making copies and handing them to other people,
53 apart from witnesses and legal advisers.
54
55 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I cannot be judge and mediator when you and
56 McDonald's have a difference about things. I have tried to
57 help in the past by mediating. It is not part of my
58 function in this court. From time to time, I have chosen
59 to do it, in the hope that the proceedings will continue.
60
