Day 077 - 25 Jan 95 - Page 31


     
     1   Q.   We are concerned only with food safety.  What, in your view
     2        (and I take them separately), are the best ways of
     3        stunning, first of all, pigs?
     4        A.  Electric tongs.
     5
     6   Q.   In your view, does the shock administered by the electric
     7        tongs to a pig need to give the pig a cardiac arrest in the
     8        interests of animal welfare or not?
     9        A.  No, but it has to be well-stunned.
    10
    11   Q.   Moving to cattle, what, in your view, is the most effective
    12        available method of stunning cattle?
    13        A.  Captive bolt pistol.
    14
    15   Q.   Have you seen in different parts of the world or earlier in
    16        your life other methods of stunning cattle?
    17        A.  Yes.
    18
    19   Q.   What sort of thing?
    20        A.  I have seen cattle stunned with a hammer, a
    21        sledgehammer, and, surprisingly enough, with a skilled man
    22        (and that was in Australia a long time ago) it was very,
    23        very effective and that man never had an animal get up, in
    24        my experience.  Interestingly enough again, he used a two
    25        pound hammer, not a four pound hammer, because he said he
    26        could not swing a four pound hammer fast enough; I mean, it
    27        is just a matter of technique.
    28
    29   Q.   If you still have the slim yellow volume, it is No. XI --
    30        you should find at tab 1 of tab 5, remember there is tab 5
    31        at the back and then another five tabs -- at tab 1, you
    32        should, I hope, find a table headed "Summary"?
    33        A.  Yes.
    34
    35   Q.   Can I ask you what this document is?
    36        A.  We did a survey of the captive bolt pistols being used
    37        by our suppliers and we did a survey (1) to ensure that
    38        there were pistols in reserve and how many pistols were in
    39        reserve in some abattoirs; we also surveyed at the same
    40        time whether or not abattoirs were pithing.
    41
    42   Q.   I am going to ask you separately about pithing in a
    43        moment.  Can we just have a look at this document?  The
    44        main table gives the make of pistol and the number of
    45        companies?
    46        A.  Yes.
    47
    48   Q.   The numbers of your suppliers.  Are all those different
    49        makes, or whatever they are, are those all captive bolt
    50        pistols? 
    51        A.  Yes. 
    52 
    53   Q.   Is there any one of your suppliers -----
    54        A.  I beg your pardon, sir.
    55
    56   Q.   What?
    57        A.  I think if you look at the five bulldozers, they are
    58        not technically a captive bolt.
    59
    60   Q.   What do they do?

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