Day 198 - 08 Dec 95 - Page 41
1 I do not see any point in coming back at 2 o'clock just to
2 have half an hour's of Civil Evidence Act witnesses, but at
3 some time, either on Monday or Tuesday, if the witnesses
4 for those days finish early, we can read those three
5 witnesses and deal with what the agenda should be for
6 Friday.
7
8 MR. RAMPTON: Yes, my Lord. As there are four minutes official
9 time left, can I just ask your Lordship, it sounds
10 impertinent pertinent, but I am a little bit concerned
11 about what your Lordship said yesterday about my use of the
12 transcripts in cross-examination. I am not sure that
13 I quite understood what your Lordship does and does not
14 wish me to do.
15
16 The reason I did what I did was, first, because I thought
17 it fairer to do so, secondly, because I had
18 (Mrs. Brinley-Codd reminded me) said that is what I would
19 do at the time when we withdrew the transcripts and, third,
20 and perhaps most powerfully, because I was reminded (I have
21 the most awful memory) that in the course of argument in
22 the Court of Appeal Sir Roger Parker said that is what I
23 would have to do. My Lord, I am in your Lordship's hands
24 -----
25
26 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Actually put the transcript?
27
28 MR. RAMPTON: Yes. "If you want to refer to the transcript in
29 cross-examination you have to give copies" which, I must
30 say, struck me as being the fair thing to do. My Lord, I
31 am not saying that your Lordship is bound by that or
32 anything like that. I just want some guidance, really,
33 from your Lordship about how your Lordship thinks it best
34 to do it, as a matter of fairness. Either I can do what
35 I did once yesterday and was then restrained by your
36 Lordship from proceeding with it, or I cannot do it at all
37 or I can do it on a different basis.
38
39 MR. JUSTICE BELL: Yes. I think what troubled me, and it may
40 not have been a very carefully thought out objection which
41 I made, is where one ends up putting, say, two sheets of
42 transcript to a witness, and I wonder whether what Sir
43 Roger Parker had in mind was that if there was going to be
44 extensive cross-examination on what had previously been
45 said, then the whole transcript of that witness's evidence
46 should be produced.
47
48 MR. RAMPTON: It is perfectly possible. I was not called on so
49 he did not say it to me.
50
51 MR. JUSTICE BELL: I just felt uncomfortable if a couple of
52 sheets at a time, which are only part of the transcript,
53 come forward. I would be perfectly content, unless and
54 until any objection is raised, you have got the transcript,
55 use it by all means. Just put to the witness: "Do you
56 remember saying that?" which is what we came to. When
57 I think about it, there is nothing very rational about
58 doing that rather than the way you propose to do it --
59 I just felt more comfortable with it.
60
