Day 096 - 03 Mar 95 - Page 23


     
     1   MS. STEEL:  So, if anything, things are better over here than
     2        they are in America?
     3        A.  I said that ours are the highest in the world.
     4
     5   Q.   Have you seen things like dry sow stalls and farrowing
     6        crates that were shown on the video when you visited farms
     7        in America?
     8        A.  Yes.
     9
    10   Q.   They would be typical of the American situation as well?
    11        A.  I do not know.  What I saw was extremely impressed with
    12         -- the most professional outfit I have ever seen in my
    13        life.
    14
    15   Q.   Why was that?
    16        A.  The whole thing had been planned extremely well and for
    17         -- I will try to explain to you.  That was a complete unit
    18        of what they call a "pod", and a pod consists of a meat
    19        plant with the pigs all around it -- when I say "all around
    20        it", I mean many square miles of area -- where they are
    21        taken individual farms and they have -- they would use
    22        stalls but they looked extremely well and it was a totally
    23        enclosed system, so that there was, I think, possibly the
    24        least disease and problems are seen with pig units possibly
    25        anywhere, apart from our own.
    26
    27   Q.   So they were not better than your system?
    28        A.  Well, there are two different concepts.  There is the
    29        American system and we are, if you like, small countrymen
    30        compared to the big ranchmen, if you like, in America.  It
    31        is a different concept there.
    32
    33   Q.   The place you visited was a major supplier of pork, was it?
    34        A.  It was.  We were asked to go over there and give advice
    35        on welfare conditions to this company.  My brother and
    36        I were specifically taken over there for that purpose.  We
    37        were there before that actually processed one pig.
    38
    39   Q.   So this was something that was new, it was being set up?
    40        A.  Yes.
    41
    42   Q.   They still had the stalls?
    43        A.  Yes.
    44
    45   Q.   The sow stalls?
    46        A.  Yes.
    47
    48   Q.   Were they the same size?
    49        A.  They looked very comfortable.  You know, we did not get
    50        out the rulers and measure them exactly, but they looked 
    51        very comfortable. 
    52 
    53   Q.   Would they have room for the sows to turn around?
    54        A.  Possibly, you know -- do not hold me to that.  As
    55        I said, I was just there walking through and they looked
    56        comfortable.
    57
    58   MR. JUSTICE BELL:  One of the stalls there, at least -- I think
    59        it was one where one was looking down on the back of the
    60        sow a bit from behind -- you could not judge to what

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